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The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

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Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#181
post #132
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your description immediately reminded me of Wikipedia. It's a shame these good projects fall to these levels.

Nonprofits gotta solicit donations. NPR does this, PBS' infamous pledge week does this. This isn't "falling," it's an old practice.

Yes that is fine. I'll donate to them again.

But can it please be without the annoying banners, "we need to talk" or similar email subjects and so on? I'm sure it helps convince some people, but doesn't it discourage more?

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#182

The purpose of DRM is ultimately asserting the will of a couple corporate ghouls over your use of the thing they basically cheated you into renting. Which wouldn't even be a thing if intellectual property rights, which are at the core of the whole debate, were untransferable and only endured for the lifetime of the creator. If anyone were able to lobby those simple, clear changes into law, the effects of that would p…

Sorry to be a bummer, but I make my living creating copyright protected material. DRM protects me and my livelihood. Yes, I often cut deals with the people you refer to as "corporate ghouls". While I often lament the terms, they aren't horrible. In the end, I make enough money to avoid searching for a job with other corporations trading in material goods. I would feel differently about the system if it weren't perfor…

DRM for software or games (which is what I assume you're talking about) is hardly comparable with DRM for movies/tv shows, they serve a very different purpose. It's basically impossible to prevent users from copying video files so it has basically no effect on piracy rates or rather it can only increase due to the horrible UX.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#183
post #150
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Netflix & Spotify are currently worth $275bn & $45bn. I think it's quite unlikely that such results would be achieved with a pay-x-get-y store model. Even Disney & Universal, themselves enormously valuable companies, are greedily eying the platform model. It has everything they want. Recurring revenues. Content pushing abilities, which is usually the most strategically important asset. Platform monopoly potential, wh…

275 billion? Seems overvalued as we enter a new cycle of more services going online.

You are probably right, but remember that Netflix is essentially a worldwide leader in producing and distributing movies - something we really haven’t seen before.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only historically, but today too. If there is one thing in the world that requires no external incentive to motivate, it’s art and creative work. The entire internet is stuffed full of people making and posting creative work, 99% of the time with no expectation of economic benefit. It would all exist anyway, without copyright “nudging it along”. Every garage band in existence would also exist without copyright. E…

> Every garage band in existence would also exist without copyright I think you are under-estimating the extent to which these people are seeking to "make it" and become profitable later. There are also lots of SV start-ups that never make any money, yet it doesn't prove that they would still exist if NONE of them EVER made any money.

I don't believe the assertion that no one would make money with creative works without copyright.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#185
post #54

>> The purpose of DRM is to give content providers leverage against creators of playback devices. This is a good spot to place the pin. The "theological" view is that (1) copyright is a moral right. (2) The Law just protects right against wrong, and(3) economic side effects of laws are incidental. Real life is a lot less naive, so to speak. The commercial intellectual property concerns at stake are are record labels,…

>> The purpose of DRM is to give content providers leverage against creators of playback devices.

I think it's noteworthy that game consoles do this in the opposite direction: give creators of playback devices leverage over content providers. This was basically why console DRM evolved in the first place (in the early forms of the 10NES lockout chip and the Atari 7800 signature scheme). Accordingly, console DRM schemes are typically stronger against unauthorized publishing of novel works than they are against unauthorized copying of already-published works (the latter being encrypted and signed in the expected way, thus only requiring subversion of a weaker "authentic disc" check). Apart from norms differing by industry, I would guess that the key to the directionality is which side thinks they can control access to a greater number of customers.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#186
I worked in the online media space for a long time, and the fact of the matter is that DRM enabled the era of networks putting their content online, it enabled Netflix, etc. - DRM was the only way to get past the liability gridlock between content owners and distributors. Also, in practice DRM is bad for users only when its presence causes friction in the legitimate viewing process. It has a bad rap because, historically, it has almost always caused a lot of friction for legitimate users.

More fundamentally, DRM is a bandaid whose need arises from trying to apply traditional economic models (of buying and selling physical, tangible things) to digital assets that never wear out and cost /essentially/ nothing to duplicate and distribute. Even basic concepts of ownership and having possession of something don't really apply in the traditional way.

If we could start from scratch, what might work is a purely use-based model, where e.g. every time you listen to a song, you pay a tiny, tiny fee for it. This creates a much stronger correlation between creators providing value and consumers deriving value from what they created, which in the long term makes more sense anyway. There are a lot of hurdles to getting there, though. On the consumer side, the concept of paying-means-owning is pretty ingrained, so we balk at the idea of continuing to pay for something after we already bought it. On the creator/provider side, the price for each use is going to seem far lower than what they think is fair, again for largely the same reason.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re severely discounting the value Netflix and Spotify provide in discovery and ease of access. I vastly prefer those services because I don’t have much interest in managing my own library.

>You’re severely discounting the value Netflix ... provide in discovery and ease of access. What the what? Discover on Netflix? If you mean accepting what they think you want to watch based on their curated lists of what they want you to watch shoved into your face in their carousels of boredom, then I'm going to have to disagree with you.

You don’t have to like Netflix, but as far as the UI goes, where are you finding better content discovery for shows and movies?

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#188
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Popcorn time was/is pretty much the pinnacle of it so I'd say they got pretty close to being better than the streaming services.

Popcord time created resillient dustributed video service, with no hosting costs. It is technologically superior to anything all those billion dollar companoes have ever created.

Not that resilient in the end, since it is mostly shut down.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re severely discounting the value Netflix and Spotify provide in discovery and ease of access. I vastly prefer those services because I don’t have much interest in managing my own library.

>You’re severely discounting the value Netflix ... provide in discovery and ease of access. What the what? Discover on Netflix? If you mean accepting what they think you want to watch based on their curated lists of what they want you to watch shoved into your face in their carousels of boredom, then I'm going to have to disagree with you.

Netflix "discovery" often feels no better than the ads before the DVD menu. Their own productions featured prominently even if they are absolute garbage, the rest is just a vague list of what's popular.

Re: The purpose of DRM is not to prevent copyright violations (2013)

#190

I worked in the online media space for a long time, and the fact of the matter is that DRM enabled the era of networks putting their content online, it enabled Netflix, etc. - DRM was the only way to get past the liability gridlock between content owners and distributors. Also, in practice DRM is bad for users only when its presence causes friction in the legitimate viewing process. It has a bad rap because, historic…

That wouldn't obviate the need for DRM, though, as there would still need to be a way for the content owner to be confident that players register each use.

And we sort of have this use-based system now, but with unlimited uses per month of active subscription.

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