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Don't dumb girls down

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251–260 of 273 posts

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#251
post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When men start treating women in the workplace as they would treat other men, HR blows a gasket .

This is sort of the argument "Well yeah, women would be perfectly welcome around here, as long as they act and respond just like men!"

So am I supposed to treat them the same, or am I supposed to change my behavior?

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#252

I mostly agree with the sentiment, but this line stuck out at me: 25 per cent of young American women would rather win America's Next Top Model than the Nobel Peace Prize. Only 25%? That's spectacularly good compared to their male counterparts. What percent of young American men do you think would rather win the Super Bowl than the Nobel Peace Prize? It's got to be at least half.

How many of those women responded to the top model because the Peace Prize is a heavily politicized prize given to the most expedient person of the hour? Maybe they should have asked something like "Nobel Prize in Medicine and Physiology" (not to say that there isn't politics in science prizes, but it's a lot better than a newly minted President Obama receiving a prize and going, Um, thanks? What did I do?).

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#253
post #78
post #38

The desire to be attractive is hard-wired into female biology. Fundamentally, we exist to survive and reproduce. Millions of years of evolution have evolved visual cues that signal health - especially reproductive health in both men and women however women's interest in successfully advertising their reproductive health is absolutely essential to what they have evolved over millions of years to do - which is bear chi…

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that looking attractive for women is basically a biological imperative? The problem, as I see it, is that the evolved visual cues signalling good reproductive health are not in the slightest bit similar to what the media purport to be attractive today. Look for example at Neolithic figurines... women with large bellies, ample bosoms, wide hips. That's not what's plast…

I read an interesting reply recently on Reddit about this. Essentially, the poster says that in what you refer to as Neolithic times, women with large bellies, ample bosoms, and wide hips were generally women who were healthy and had access to food and the ability to get it for themselves. Men were biologically attracted to this display of "wealth".

Contrast that to today, where having wealth means having the disposal to hire personal trainers, time to exercise, and not having to eat processed foods. Women of wealth will typically go to lengths to look a certain way (tan, skinny, etc.). I know that wealth is different from being in good reproductive health, but being wealthy definitely plays an important role in determining mates. As the definition of wealth changed, so did men's interest in women.

Sorry about the lack of citations, but it was a while ago and from a secondhand source, so I would take it with a grain of salt. It does sound reasonable though.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#254
post #8
post #6

"Teaching girls that their appearance is the first thing you notice tells them that looks are more important than anything." Hate to say it, but what if they are? Lots of studies show that pretty people get further in life. Not that I mind girls being interested in other things, but perhaps the ideology should be kept in check. Even if a girl doesn't care about her looks, other people will, and she has to learn to de…

"Lots of studies show that pretty people get further in life." [citation needed]

I apologize. I perhaps should have said 'What studies say that?'.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#256
post #253
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying that looking attractive for women is basically a biological imperative? The problem, as I see it, is that the evolved visual cues signalling good reproductive health are not in the slightest bit similar to what the media purport to be attractive today. Look for example at Neolithic figurines... women with large bellies, ample bosoms, wide hips. That's not what's plast…

I read an interesting reply recently on Reddit about this. Essentially, the poster says that in what you refer to as Neolithic times, women with large bellies, ample bosoms, and wide hips were generally women who were healthy and had access to food and the ability to get it for themselves. Men were biologically attracted to this display of "wealth". Contrast that to today, where having wealth means having the disposa…

This was true of more modern times (thinking Tudor times - Henry VIII etc), but not Neolithic times.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the problems begin when people start trying to paint behaviour as an immutable product of predefined genetic destiny, and then using this to support political stances that promote their own status in society" At the same time, trying to change people's behavior is a lot like cutting down the rainforest or wiping out indigenous peoples. It sounds like a great idea, but the destruction of cognitive and behavioral dive…

"the destruction of cognitive and behavioral diversity is probably going to lead to our extinction in the long run." What an interesting idea. It would make an excellent central concept for a work of speculative fiction, and probably already has.

Something like that is important in "The Lion of Comarre" by Arthur Clarke.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#258
post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"How did we manage to have a disorder that affects nearly 10% teenagers?" A combination of rising maternal age, increased body load of many environment contaminants, terrible diets, ubiquitous TV watching before age 2, parental drug use (everything from starbucks to antibiotics), etc. From a draft version of the latest EPA report: "Between 1993 and 2007, the rate of preterm birth rose from 11.0% of births in 1993 to…

> ...and impulsivity, which are common behaviors of ADHD, and exposures to lead, PCBs, mercury, and certain pesticides. Animal studies that examine the link between environmental exposures and animal models of ADHD, or common ADHD behaviors, provide supporting evidence that exposures to lead, PCBs, mercury, and pesticides may contribute to ADHD. Sure, so how do you explain my two brothers along with myself and mother…

The environment can affect things like DNA methylation.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't recall developing an eating disorder or wearing makeup at an early age Shouldn't you take this as evidence that there is something different in the way girls and boys are treated? In case you're not aware, eating disorders are horrifyingly prevalent among college-age women. [this statistic]( http://www.anad.org/get-information/about-eating-disorders/e... ) reports 25% engage in purging, and in my anecdotal…

Consider the following: In order to look how fashion advertisers tell them they should look, women have to have extraordinarily low body fat. In order to look how fashion advertisers tell them they should look, men have to have extraordinarily low body fat... and high muscle mass. If you know anything about body building you'll know that the second is extremely hard to do. Building muscle mass while at the same time…

You should pay more attention. Most middle age men on tv are fat. Zero middle age women on tv are fat.

Super models aren't the role model. Raymond is.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#260
If beauty consciousness in girls can be said as peer pressure then geek/nerd consciousness in boys can be said as peer pressure as well. Boys who don't play videogames or watch sci-fi/action movies or listen to some complex rock/electronic music genre or those who are not gadget freaks or those who're not into science/technology/engineering in general are seen as less masculine (at least in a first world society).

I think the reason why femininity is looked down is the economic models of the last 150 years which have favored science over art, rationality over irrationality and utility over authenticity. I think the world needs a second romantic era to truly appreciate the feminine aspects of beauty/creativity/genuineness.

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