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Don't dumb girls down

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241–250 of 273 posts

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#241
post #53

What a beautiful story of her interaction with that little girl. I hope i'm like that with my daughter when she's that age :)

That's also a good way to interact with little boys, incidentally. It makes you a much more interesting adult than someone who just says and does the same boring things as every other adult who is suddenly faced with a child.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#242
post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lack of women in the military is purely a result of sound military strategy. Suppose two idealized states in a perpetual state of war, where they have frequent engagements in which both sides lose 50% of their soldiers in each generation. The state that uses no women as soldiers whatsoever will eventually win. This is because of biology, but it is not because of any sort of hardwired instincts. It's just that 200…

Militaries do not think like this. They do not plan like this. If they did, they would only allow gay men in the military. In fact the opposite happens. Your theory doesn't match reality.

I'm not talking about the modern military. I'm talking about the constraints under which humans evolved. I'm also simply looking at it from the assumption that all the players are rational actors, and the rational choice is to maximize chances of victory in warfare.

I think the modern world is much more complex, and the rational choice in general (possibly even in antiquity) is to avoid violence if at all possible and find mutually beneficial solutions to resource scarcity.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#243
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is worth thinking over. I think a lot of boys do aspire the adrenaline rush professions. But if they don't end up being one, do they now resign from their whole lives and just go saying the social persuasions to be such, destroyed their whole lives? There is always going to be a social persuasion for nearly everything. They way we eat, dress, talk nearly anything people can see, people can pass a comment on. And…

You are correct in that there are social persuasions for almost everything in a society, and that is true for sexist roles and definitions for both men and women. Feminism and anti-sexism are not about empowering women over others, but rather allowing for equality among all genders. Any person of any gender should be allowed to pursue being a primary provider if they so choose, just as any person with a child should…

That's the stated goal, but it never works that way, at least in the rhetorical sense.

If a woman makes a conscious decision to choose a career path or take time out of her career to raise children, for example, that is often perceived by some feminists as an example of the influence of a patriarchal society on women.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#244
post #188

The amount of ignorance and misogyny in here is staggering. Have any of you ever actually talked to a woman? I'll boil down the argument into one that favors women: Men are biologically programmed to be violent. We should find it as no surprise that the vast majority of violent criminals are men. After all, it's their biology. And thus all men should be regarded as likely violent in the right circumstances. Also we s…

Most of the people on here are debating the degree that gender affects life choices and goals (obviously it does to some degree). It's not misogyny to debate the differences between men and women. No one is advocating that women should be categorically denied access to certain societal roles.

If I said: "Because of X, Y, & Z it's possible that biology has had more effect on female career choices than the 'patriarchy'." Does that make me a misogynist? Could there be any answer to why genders cluster around certain careers other than the 'patriarchy'? If that's the only answer you could ever acknowledge and anything else is "ignorance and misogyny" I think you should examine that.

And your argument is exactly how men are treated, and many of those biases are institutional. Imagine if women weren't allowed to seek protection from domestic violence, and had no reproductive rights at all? That's the world every man lives in. It's a little insulting to be admonished how to properly speak to women, while men are imprisoned every day because of their gender.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the social/behavioural problems of aspergers (autism spectrum disorder) are diagnosed in men at a 4x greater ratio than women.

Leading us to believe that Autism may have a genetic root. But does that mean we should treat women differently from men? Fuck no.

When men start treating women in the workplace as they would treat other men, HR blows a gasket.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#246
post #31

None of this advice applies to me, of course. As a man and therefore a child molesting rapist just waiting for my chance to strike, the idea that I could have any sort of conversation with a little girl - let alone sit down on a couch and talk privately - is simply laughable.

There ought to be a Godwin's Law about threads talking about gender on the Internet. Given a certain concentration of comments on the subject, a sarcastic and baseless complaint of the assumption of male guilt (especially absurb, off topic comments about rape!) must appear.

Well, is he wrong? I know I make an active effort to avoid children...

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, same sort of normative ideas + Reductio ad absurdum = what you said. Clearly, there are cultural differences. However, name one country that’s military is made up of significantly more women than men. Far more women in the US go to college today than men do, go back 50 years and the ratios was very different. So clearly cultural norms change, yet there is less cultural diversity than you would expect if biolog…

The lack of women in the military is purely a result of sound military strategy. Suppose two idealized states in a perpetual state of war, where they have frequent engagements in which both sides lose 50% of their soldiers in each generation. The state that uses no women as soldiers whatsoever will eventually win. This is because of biology, but it is not because of any sort of hardwired instincts. It's just that 200…

Various nations through history have used all female fighting units for psychological power. It isn't a sound military strategy, it is cultural belief. Many cultures consider men to be more expendable and that makes killing them easier. For a modern counter example, can you imagine the effectiveness of an all gay special forces regiment against the Taliban? Can you imagine morale within Taliban forces after getting repeatedly defeated by an all gay unit? Read some history, the same thing has been done several times with all female forces. Militaries are predominantly men only for cultural reasons.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find these articles boorish. When I was a little boy I distinctly recall every stranger I met telling me how handsome I was because it's a superficial complement that can be delivered without great insight. Aunt's used to tell me that I'd "break some ladies hearts" because they didn't know me, and had no idea if I was intelligent or not. How intelligent can a five year old be, anyway? I didn't see little Maya pick…

> I don't recall developing an eating disorder or wearing makeup at an early age Shouldn't you take this as evidence that there is something different in the way girls and boys are treated? In case you're not aware, eating disorders are horrifyingly prevalent among college-age women. [this statistic]( http://www.anad.org/get-information/about-eating-disorders/e... ) reports 25% engage in purging, and in my anecdotal…

Consider the following:

In order to look how fashion advertisers tell them they should look, women have to have extraordinarily low body fat.

In order to look how fashion advertisers tell them they should look, men have to have extraordinarily low body fat... and high muscle mass.

If you know anything about body building you'll know that the second is extremely hard to do. Building muscle mass while at the same time keeping body fat to extremely low levels is a rather unnatural thing to do, far more unnatural than just being skinny. Not only that, but it's not strictly dietary, it takes time and money to build that muscle mass.

So why do women have more eating disorders than men, who actually have a harder time achieving their "greek god" form?

My guess is women take what they see in advertising too seriously. The majority of guys in this world don't actually expect their women to look like that, and the standard reaction to women who demand that from their men is "fuck it".

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#249

To all the people in this thread who seem so absolutely sure that the gender differences are strictly biological, do you fancy telling us what exactly makes you so sure? Last time I checked there was no evidence to support this idea. Obviously there are easily observed physiological differences in brain structure and in the endocrine system etc, however it is a massive leap to go from that to asserting that observed…

I honestly think the nature vs nurture thing is a red herring. The difference between individuals in either population are far greater than the differences between the two populations. Sure, maybe statistically women are a few ticks higher or lower on certain measures than men, but when you look at women and men at the individual level, there is going to be a very broad spectrum, and yet women will still be treated differently.

Re: Don't dumb girls down

#250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Leading us to believe that Autism may have a genetic root. But does that mean we should treat women differently from men? Fuck no.

When men start treating women in the workplace as they would treat other men, HR blows a gasket .

This is sort of the argument "Well yeah, women would be perfectly welcome around here, as long as they act and respond just like men!"
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