Locked-out New Zealanders outraged as visa scheme for rich foreigners resumes

Post by fennecfoxen » Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:14 AM UTC

nowherebeen wrote: post #89

fennecfoxen wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not describing Rule of Law. The rule of law is what you use to say that people are treated according to the law, not given special exceptions or punishments because of how much they are liked or hated. The opposite of the rule of law is generally the “rule of men” and is typified by the powerful having the discretion to punish enemies on a whim. Consider, for instance, someone who brings forth a charge of sex…

> It seems like the outrage is about these brand-new residents getting equal treatment with current residents, instead of the current residents getting priority. This seems flawed to me. Do poor people get to queue up for MIQ? No, because they can’t qualify for the visa scheme because they aren’t rich enough. So it’s not really equal treatment for these new residents because they are already given an advantage becaus…

Post by aunty_helen » Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:26 AM UTC

lcpriest wrote: post #64

aunty_helen wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, the entire MIQ program is a gross violation of the bill of rights and several international treaties. So I don't think the rule of law goes very far in NZ as they seem to just handwave it away and most people in NZ couldn't care less because of the fear they have from living reasonably isolated for the past year and a half. NZers should expect to be on the hook for at least a few class action lawsuits for d…

I don't think the NZ bill of rights is applied the same way as other countries. > Section 4 specifically denies the Act any supremacy over other legislation. The section states that Courts looking at cases under the Act cannot implicitly repeal or revoke, or make invalid or ineffective, or decline to apply any provision of any statute made by parliament, whether before or after the Act was passed because it is incons…

Post by nowherebeen » Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

fennecfoxen wrote: post #91

nowherebeen wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems like the outrage is about these brand-new residents getting equal treatment with current residents, instead of the current residents getting priority. This seems flawed to me. Do poor people get to queue up for MIQ? No, because they can’t qualify for the visa scheme because they aren’t rich enough. So it’s not really equal treatment for these new residents because they are already given an advantage becaus…

I'm very much for radically open borders — in economic terms, it's one of those twenty-trillion dollar bills lying around on the sidewalk that no one has picked up yet. And okay, that's a reasonable point to make — in isolation. But in context, do you honestly suggest that the New Zealand outrage described here would be remedied by opening more visas to more people, and getting them into the quarantine?

Post by pixel_fcker » Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:48 AM UTC

vanusa wrote: post #92

laingc wrote: post #40

As a New Zealander, I am super supportive of easier pathways for wealthy people to bring themselves, their expertise, their connections, and their money here. Furthermore, my anecdotal observation is that articles in The Guardian about New Zealand reflect not reality, but rather the talking points of a very small subset of the hard Left of our political class. I know that this is The Guardian’s line in general, but i…

As a New Zealander, I am super supportive of easier pathways for wealthy people to bring themselves, their expertise, their connections, and their money here. Do you support denying re-entry to people who are already citizens as a means of doing that?

Post by nowherebeen » Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:55 AM UTC

bobthepanda wrote: post #98

nowherebeen wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of brings the question should this kind of visa scheme exist in the first place during Covid. From my very limited knowledge, these are just pledges, not actual investments. Given a) NZ tiny market, b) high corporate tax rate, and c) isolation as an Oceania island (shipping), would it make sense to invest in NZ right now? My bet is that they expect Covid to end in the next 1-2 years and all these rich peopl…

My understanding of these schemes is that they are generally designed for rich people who accumulated wealth in countries where they might like to have a backup option if their government gets in a particularly seize-y mood. (e.g. China or Russia)