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Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

reuters.com

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Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#51

Post by Dylan16807 »

nichtich wrote: post #25
ngc248 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it slave labour, I mean are they being forced to do it and not being paid for it, then sure boycott it. If NOT, and if it is an avenue for prisoners to earn money, benefits, then don't boycott it

Once you are already in prison it's hard to say whether you are forced to do it or not. It's not like you have a lot of employers and professions to choose from. And if the incentives include things like easier to get parole then refusing to participate would mean more time served. It'd be pretty hard to prove some labor is not "forced" in a prison setting.

> And if the incentives include things like easier to get parole then refusing to participate would mean more time served.

So what? That's just serving the original sentence. That doesn't sound forced to me. Is it forced labor when someone chooses to take a community service option instead of being locked up?

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#52

Post by dkjaudyeqooe »

xwolfi wrote: post #29
andy_ppp wrote: post #11

I think we should stop using China for cheap Labour in general given how hostile their government are becoming. Where possible I try to buy Taiwanese, Korean and Japanese electronics.

If we can't employ Xinjian people anymore, what do you propose we do with them ?

Set them free.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#53

Post by logicchains »

einpoklum wrote: post #38
andy_ppp wrote: post #11

I think we should stop using China for cheap Labour in general given how hostile their government are becoming. Where possible I try to buy Taiwanese, Korean and Japanese electronics.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

>If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non-US-aligned media sources.

Here's an official Chinese government source defending the use of labour/"re-education" camps in Xinjiang: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/201903/19/WS5c9033f0a3106c65c... . In past the Chinese government didn't send large numbers of people to camps based on their ethnicity.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#54

Post by yorwba »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #18

It's interesting to see that people on both sides are angry -- for different reasons. People on western Internet are angry at Intel for having issued an apology. People on Chinese Internet are angry because they view it as a non-apology, i.e. Intel still goes ahead with the ban. I see people -- including Chinese diaspora -- calling for banning Intel.

Personally, I'm most angry that Intel refuses to properly audit their suppliers. They're not actually banned from importing goods from Xinjiang if they can prove that they weren't made with forced labor.

If they could prove that, the US government should be happy (because their stated goal of combating forced labor is respected) and Chinese people should be happy, too (better working conditions).

Merely restricting suppliers based on geography is a non-solution, since it's not like forced labor magically stops if you cross a provincial border.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#55

Post by throwawaylinux »

pjc50 wrote: post #22
lazyeye wrote: post #19

Quoted post unavailable.

> history of being woke? Define this in a way we could pattern-match against their behavior?

The word is pretty mainstream (at least in western countries) now. Check Urban Dictionary.

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=woke

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#57

Post by throwaway2048 »

ekianjo wrote: post #3
tjpnz wrote: post #2

Is there a list of companies who've made similar apologies in the past? When presented with a choice I would prefer to avoid them.

probably close to 100% of them. It will be difficult to organize a boycott. The next best thing is to rank them by order of who knelt the fastest to China.

I very much doubt close to 100% of companies have issued apologies to china

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#58

Post by elihu »

> "Intel (INTC.O) recently published what it described as an annual letter to suppliers, dated December, that it had been 'required to ensure that its supply chain does not use any labour or source goods or services from the Xinjiang region', following restrictions imposed by 'multiple governments'."

As policies go, that one seems kind of clumsy. Assuming for the sake of argument that Uighurs are being used for forced labor in China (which I'm inclined to believe), then isn't "workers in Xinjiang region are forced labor, workers outside of Xinjiang are not" a bit of an oversimplification? Presumably there is also non-forced labor happening in Xinjiang, and probably some amount of forced labor happening outside Xinjiang.

I suppose sometimes simple heuristics can work well enough to get the job done and more complicated supply chain audits might be too hard. (One obvious alternative is to just stop trading with China at all, but that's a policy that's unlikely to be enacted by the U.S. or other large nations for equally obvious reasons.)

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#59

Post by chloerei »

As a Chinese, I think the logic of certain Western countries is ridiculous. Because Xinjiang’s human rights situation is considered to be problematic, so Xinjiang’s companies are banned. As an analogy, can I think that the human rights situation of African Americans is terrible, so I need to ban companies that employ African Americans?

These bans will only make the living conditions of minorities worse, because they may lose their jobs because of the ban.

By the way, Uyghurs live and work in every province in China, especially in the catering industry. I have never heard complaints about forced labor. American propaganda makes me feel ridiculous, but it seems to be working.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#60

Post by samus »

jollybean wrote: post #32
1cvmask wrote: post #5

Should we demand that companies avoid California suppliers as well because of the extensive use of prison labor: https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-10-11/californ... https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/policing/2020/11/11/c... https://www.freedomunited.org/news/forced-prison-labor-in-ca...

China has a Justice System, and most people are in prison for crimes. China does not have a Justice System - it's entirely politicized (people are put to death in private trials with fabricated evidence), but even then, we are not banning stuff 'because Chinese prison'. We are banning specifically from concentration camps where 100's of thousands of Uyghurs are imprisoned not for any crime, but merely because of thei…

I think the first paragraph should be fixed. Slightly contradicts the rest of the comment, no? ;-)
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