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Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

reuters.com

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Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#41

Post by KennyBlanken »

einpoklum wrote: post #38
andy_ppp wrote: post #11

I think we should stop using China for cheap Labour in general given how hostile their government are becoming. Where possible I try to buy Taiwanese, Korean and Japanese electronics.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

The burden is on the person making a claim, not on others to disprove it. Furthermore, "no US aligned media sources" is ad hominem. Objective facts don't become falsehoods because of who is saying them.

Since you've formed the opinion that Chinese government policy hasn't become more repressive, and that opinion is clearly educated, surely you have plenty of links to give us to back up your position.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#42

Post by einpoklum »

jollybean wrote: post #28
rg111 wrote: post #17

China has got a massive consumer market, an unmatched manufacturing ecosystem with zero labor disputes among other things, minerals, arguably the most stable (in terms of violence, unrest, strikes, etc.) regions in the world, and more. They have got anyone by their balls who remotely wants to sell anything in China. John Cena (famous wrestler, entertainer) recently apologized to Chinese people after calling Taiwan a…

Surprisingly, there are a lot of strikes, labour issues, and general unrest in China. Instead of thinking about it like a 'Orwellian State' - think of it more like an Orwellian State that could go 'off' at anytime. Note that citizens are concerned about their prosperity - as long as growth is happening and money comes in - they are content. But they are also ultra nationalist and ultra ethnocentric to the point where…

> Surprisingly, there are a lot of strikes, labour issues, and general unrest in China.

It only surprises people if they consider China as one of:

* A harmonious socialist utopia, or

* A totalitarian dystopia

unfortunately, the US government and mainstream news media are trying to paint China as the latter of the two.

----

Also, irrespective of the extent of nationalism in China, western or US imperialism is a thing. Before the 20th century it was literal empires with physical conquest, and these days it is a combination of economic influence and military interventions. Of course it also serves as a convenient excuse and distraction...

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#43

Post by undecisive »

> Intel, which has 10,000 employees in China, said in its apology that it "respected the sensitivity of the issue in China."

This reminds me of a recent British politics round-table interview, where a member of the ruling party told the world that we shouldn't call politicians liars - despite the current Prime Minister lying through his teeth at almost every opportunity simply because he can get away with it - because it would undermine people's faith in the political system that keeps lying to them.

It seems that saying the things that need to be said about the political systems that need to be called out is not as important as getting the money (or savings) that the countries attached to those political systems can generate.

Or, as a great man once sang:

    For china (f'china x 4) is a country that can bring us to our knees.
Not sure there's a solution to this though. Power will always corrupt.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#44

Post by thaumasiotes »

andy_ppp wrote: post #11

I think we should stop using China for cheap Labour in general given how hostile their government are becoming. Where possible I try to buy Taiwanese, Korean and Japanese electronics.

> given how hostile their government are becoming

To the extent that they are more hostile now, that would look like an effect of American attacks on them, not a cause. Causes need to precede effects.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#46

Post by dazsnow »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #41
einpoklum wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

The burden is on the person making a claim, not on others to disprove it. Furthermore, "no US aligned media sources" is ad hominem. Objective facts don't become falsehoods because of who is saying them. Since you've formed the opinion that Chinese government policy hasn't become more repressive, and that opinion is clearly educated, surely you have plenty of links to give us to back up your position.

Listen to the Sinica podcast. It covers China-related topics "without fear nor favor". You'll here politicians and experts talk about the increasing, and often baseless, hostility of Western media over the past 5 years.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#47

Post by thaumasiotes »

jollybean wrote: post #24
lazyeye wrote: post #19

Quoted post unavailable.

Not buying products from forced labour concentration camps is generally not an issue of 'wokeness'. Hypocritical wokeness (in the pejorative sense) would be Nike shifting from performance atheletes to SJ athletes like Kaeernick, who sadly has made a direct comparison between the NFL selection process and slave auction. And Nike of course sources shoes in Asia from factories with very suspect labour practices. The US…

No post body was provided.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#48

Post by hkt »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #41
einpoklum wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

The burden is on the person making a claim, not on others to disprove it. Furthermore, "no US aligned media sources" is ad hominem. Objective facts don't become falsehoods because of who is saying them. Since you've formed the opinion that Chinese government policy hasn't become more repressive, and that opinion is clearly educated, surely you have plenty of links to give us to back up your position.

Objective facts can become very hard to discern in a highly partisan environment though. That's the problem with how lots of US (and UK, etc) media works: there's obvious partisanship which can make it hard to extract the truth. Everything ends up as "the truth + highly political framing devices". There is no outside to observe from.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#49

Post by cgio »

einpoklum wrote: post #38
andy_ppp wrote: post #11

I think we should stop using China for cheap Labour in general given how hostile their government are becoming. Where possible I try to buy Taiwanese, Korean and Japanese electronics.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

It has tightened e.g. in HK and significantly so. With these things it’s not a matter of averaging oppression to judge the level. If a specific group of people, geographic area, etc. are being targeted you don’t really judge based on how the rest are doing.

Re: Intel apologises in China over Xinjiang supplier statement

#50

Post by yorwba »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #41
einpoklum wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Umm, with respect - it is the US anti-Chinese rhetoric that is changing, rather than Chinese government policy. There are many repressive aspects to the Chinese regime (and government specifically I suppose); but this is probably less the case today then, say, 30 years ago. Certainly I doubt very much repression has been tightened over the past few years. If I'm mistaken - please provide references, preferably to non…

The burden is on the person making a claim, not on others to disprove it. Furthermore, "no US aligned media sources" is ad hominem. Objective facts don't become falsehoods because of who is saying them. Since you've formed the opinion that Chinese government policy hasn't become more repressive, and that opinion is clearly educated, surely you have plenty of links to give us to back up your position.

1990 (still roughly qualifies as 30 years ago, I guess): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baren_Township_conflict
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