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Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

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Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#181

Post by mlyle »

jjulius wrote: post #70
jmarbach wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am vaccinated - I believe in the early vaccine's efficacy for stopping serious illness. They have saved many lives. What I am saying here is that the vaccines were marketed as 90% effective for preventing infection. Was I misunderstanding what was being marketed to me all along?

Yes, you have misunderstood this all along, and that misunderstanding has already been pointed out to you in this thread[1]. It is effective at preventing COVID-19 infections, which you get after being infected with SARA-CoV-2. It never claimed to prevent infection of the latter. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29619347

> It never claimed to prevent infection of the latter.

We had some early data that looked like they were probably about ~70% effective for preventing infection, ~90% effective at preventing symptoms, and >95% effective at preventing severe illness.

These numbers are interesting, because they mean you have less of a chance of becoming infected, but a larger chance, if infected, of being an asymptomatic carrier. So it's difficult to predict the net effect on transmission (probably a benefit, but..)

Now for 2 doses of mRNA vaccine, our best guesses for omicron are more like ~??%, ~30%, and ~70% respectively. Offsetting it slightly is that it looks like omicron may be a bit less likely to cause severe illness at baseline. But, no matter what, this is a big setback.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#182

Post by loudtieblahblah »

tootie wrote: post #131
brainphreeze wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of the things you've said are just flat out incorrect. It's blatantly obvious you're parroting CNN and Late Show hacks.

Quoted post unavailable.

Exactly the sources one would expect.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#183

Post by mthoms »

vidoc wrote: post #130
jjulius wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Scientists are not yet sure of how the vaccine affects transmission – and this is currently undergoing research. I don't know how much clearer they can get with that next sentence.

(replying to your last message) If you read my initial message one more time, you may notice that I mentionned a google serach container. I'm not certain it is the appropriate term but basically, you can ask a question to google and it will select an authoritative answer from a trusted source (Reuters, AP, etc). Back in the early day of the vaccine, if you were to ask google whether the vaccine prevents the transmiss…

How do you have the exact quotation and why is it phrased as a double negative? That sentence just doesn’t sound authoritative or believable in any way.

Are you paraphrasing? If so, that’s fine but please don’t use quotation marks in that case.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#184

Post by supertrope »

vidoc wrote: post #180
supertrope wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't watch sensationalist cable news. What do you mean exactly by CNNesque?

I don't know, the idea that the spread of the Delta variant can be attributed to the "unvaccinated", whose morality is so low that they also happen to often be "anti-mask" as well. This is the kind of scapegoating i would imagine CNN do (I'm being unfair here, CNN would probably add a bit of Russian disinformation as well for good culture war mesure.) I'm ready to change my mind tho if you back your statement with fa…

The spread of Delta is because that variant is more infectious and there is a reservoir of unvaccinated people. The CDC said vaccinated people can take off their masks. They did not say everyone can stop masking. Masking immediately dropped from 75% to 25%. We are not at 75% vaccine coverage even today.

Measles is an example of another highly infectious moderately deadly disease. Wherever we don’t have 97%+ vaccine coverage we have outbreaks.

Even today with the questions about Omicron’s degree of immune escape there’s theoretically a solution available to use. If 95% of people masked we could get spread under control in 6-10 weeks. But masks are a dirty word and public health campaigns have ceilings to adoption.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#185

Post by CydeWeys »

mlyle wrote: post #145
CydeWeys wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, immunocompromised people often can't take vaccines. Nope. Immunocompromised people need extra doses of the vaccine, and even then it doesn't work as well. This is one of those false talking points that antivaxxers love to spread.

It's just conflating/confused: * Immunocompromised people have poor efficacy with the vaccine even with boosters, like my dad who has SLL. * Other people who have autoimmune and inflammatory conditions are often immunocompromised (because of taking low dose chemotherapy, etc, to manage their conditions). Also, recommending a vaccine for these people is complicated, because vaccines can kick up immune and inflammatory…

In all these cases, though, the immunocompromised person who is not greatly benefiting from the vaccine is at much greater risk of dying from COVID. The sane response for them is to be very very careful about any potential exposure, NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate.

My friend is immunocompromised from chemotherapy, has had (I believe) at least 4 COVID shots by now, and just had to go to the hospital for monoclonal antibodies after catching COVID. Not getting vaccinated, then getting a vaccine waiver instead of the vaccine, then going and doing in-person stuff that would've otherwise required the vaccine would've been practically suicidal for her.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#186

Post by dang »

jmarbach wrote: post #14
jjulius wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

You are completely wrong -- totally warped by the narrative. Look at the Pfizer press release, Nov 9, 2020 - the first sentence: "Vaccine candidate was found to be more than 90% effective in preventing COVID-19 in participants without evidence of prior SARS-CoV-2 infection in the first interim efficacy analysis" https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-deta...

Please edit swipes out of your comments here. They only make things worse.

Your post would be fine without the first sentence.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#187

Post by refurb »

epgui wrote: post #170
refurb wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. In countries that have vaccination rates and strict compliance to measure the cases keep going up. The goalposts move because the experts were wrong.

Did you know you happened to be speaking to one such expert? Today is your lucky day, it’s your chance to enlighten me: what were the experts wrong about?

- herd immunity

- driving R-value below 1 will cause Covid to extinguish itself

- vaccine will prevent infection

- vaccinated can get infected but don’t really infect others

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#188

Post by dang »

throwaway2016a wrote: post #49
jmarbach wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are arguing over semantics. In reality, the Pfizer vax has proven to be less than 10% effective at stopping a future infection.

The efficacy is pretty well proven to be > 90% at this point. Per your comment where you admit the number was pulled out of thin air: > Anecdotal. You do not need to be a meteorologist to know when it's raining. Look outside. I'll raise you this... where I am 100% of ICU cases are unvaccinated. Read that again 100%. And over 85% of hospitalizations. And before you say "see, 15% of them were breakthrough cases," pleas…

Please do not cross into personal attack. That's against the site guidelines and just makes everything worse, regardless of how right you are or feel you are.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#189

Post by mlyle »

CydeWeys wrote: post #185
mlyle wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just conflating/confused: * Immunocompromised people have poor efficacy with the vaccine even with boosters, like my dad who has SLL. * Other people who have autoimmune and inflammatory conditions are often immunocompromised (because of taking low dose chemotherapy, etc, to manage their conditions). Also, recommending a vaccine for these people is complicated, because vaccines can kick up immune and inflammatory…

In all these cases, though, the immunocompromised person who is not greatly benefiting from the vaccine is at much greater risk of dying from COVID. The sane response for them is to be very very careful about any potential exposure, NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate. My friend is immunocompromised from che…

> In all these cases,

In the second case, the person choosing the vaccine has a high risk of, say, a debilitating RA flareup and an uncertain amount of protection given their immunocompromised status. I can totally understand why some in this position choose not to.

They probably should, but this is not as clear-cut of a decision as for those of us with normal immune capability. No one knows the exact efficacy they can expect nor the amount of risk of side effect they are shouldering.

> NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate.

Yah, I don't think anyone advocated for quite that-- just some middle ground where they can choose to assume some risk. A lot of us hoped that perhaps population immunity could do the work of shielding these people, but it looks like that ship has sailed.

Re: Pfizer’s Covid-19 Pill is 89% Effective in Phase 2/3 Study

#190

Post by dang »

warning26 wrote: post #80
hunterb123 wrote: post #68

Quoted post unavailable.

You can enable "Show Dead" in your user prefs if you want to see flagged comments. Spoiler alert: they're all conspiracy theorizing about how this _proves_ that the entire pandemic is all a part of Pfizer's master plan for making money.

"Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

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