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The Web3 Fraud

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Re: The Web3 Fraud

#101

Post by dang »

SubiculumCode wrote: post #9
nihonde wrote: post #6

You reach for Web3 when your requirements include: (a) self-sovereign ID/auth, and/or (b) hosted materials that can't be censored via a centralized hosting provider. Horses for courses. ps. Does he think Web3 is about storing data on the blockchain network? It's not. Ex. https://ceramic.network/

Sometimes bloggers gotta blog, even when they just know a little bit and are just regurgitating an iteration of their preconceived notions. Edit: Of course you get voted down because you make a substantive comment. Welcome to Hacker News' Crytpo Hater Crowd.

Please don't break the site guidelines like this. I realize it's frustrating when you feel surrounded by a lot of people who you feel are wrong, but there's a guideline for that too:

"Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#102

Post by nwah1 »

Misdicorl wrote: post #59
v64 wrote: post #13

Many criticisms of blockchain apps, comparing their use cases to conventional technologies (databases, conventional separation of services such as that described in the article, etc) all seem to miss a major point: Dapps running on the blockchain are immutable and highly resistant to being shutdown. Immutability is important because it's guaranteed that no matter how many times you interact with a contract address, y…

Unless there is a killer feature it enables, it's an implementation detail and I don't care. And I will gladly compare other solutions against blockchain despite not having the same implementation detail you claim puts it above comparison. And so will everyone else that isn't blinded by fanaticism.

APIs have versions. Facebook guarantees that the API for version X will perform the documented behavior.

If it fails to, then it is probably a bug that they will have to fix. If the API were immutable, then the bug would not be possible to fix.

The immutability is the exact opposite of a feature.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#103

Post by bawolff »

menzoic wrote: post #35
bawolff wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the value proposition of all the crypto nonsense is that some people don't like trusted entities. I tend to think its not worth the trade off (and the "decentralization" is questionable in practise), but this line of criticism is basically begging the question.

>the value proposition of all the crypto nonsense is that some people don't like trusted entities. Becoming a trusted entity is hard. Crypto allows for the creation of systems that don't require trusted entites. That's a huge win for the little guy and catalyst for innovation.

I'm not saying there aren't rational reasons to dislike trusted entities. At a minimum they are single points of failure. But all this does come at a high cost.

The real questions to ask with blockchain stuff:

- at what cost does this lack of trusted entitids come at? I don't just mean in terms of money but also engineering complexity

- what are the hidden trust relationships? Plenty of blockchain stuff still involved trusted entities, its just hidden through layers of indirection. The only thing worse than a trusted entity you dont trust is a trusted entity you don't even know exists.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#104

Post by mwattsun »

selestify wrote: post #57
mwattsun wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> opens up possibilities for your app to be shut down Is this a big worry for a lot of people or is just one of the possible things that can go wrong incidental to doing business, like a traffic ticket is to driving?

It's definitely a worry for people doing illegal businesses, for example all the drug markets. Depending on your political allegiances, that's either a good thing or a bad thing, but either way, real value is being created for some people here. It's also a worry for people who are traditionally blocked from doing business -- for example, anyone who's got some sanctions placed on them. Again, could be a good thing or…

Hopefully, the number of people you are talking about is fairly small, or maybe I'm just out of touch with the rise of crime and corruption on the dark web - but I wouldn't lose any sleep if they got shut down. I'm fairly libertarian about drug use, but there's a lot of other terrible stuff that is enabled along with drugs in this system.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#105

Post by vmception »

simonw wrote: post #7
vmception wrote: post #2

What if you just dropped all the ideology speak and just called them platforms? Theyre open finance platforms. Everyone building bullshit on Shopify’s platform is the exact audience that would be better off building on an open finance platform (the shopify apps that are sold to merchants). That crowd just wants to launch a product, have users, and make money passively. Thats what defi builders are doing on web3 platf…

How is building against defi better than building on Shopify if you want to sell things to regular people who just want to exchange their money for things that they want?

The shopify apps on their app marketplace is what I’m referring to. These are sold to merchants hoping to do something easier.

All defi products help people already in the defi ecosystem do something easier.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#106

Post by namlem »

v64 wrote: post #13

Many criticisms of blockchain apps, comparing their use cases to conventional technologies (databases, conventional separation of services such as that described in the article, etc) all seem to miss a major point: Dapps running on the blockchain are immutable and highly resistant to being shutdown. Immutability is important because it's guaranteed that no matter how many times you interact with a contract address, y…

That's all well and good for the handful of niche services that rely heavily on immutability but not performance, but the vast majority of applications need performance as well.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#107

Post by esjeon »

v64 wrote: post #21
endisneigh wrote: post #5

I don’t understand what problem web3 can solve that a trusted entity cannot. And let’s keep in mind your reply to this comment will be using a trusted entity. In fact in the history of the internet I cannot find a single example of any technology working better in a decentralized fashion compared to centralized for the end user

> In fact in the history of the internet I cannot find a single example of any technology working better in a decentralized fashion compared to centralized for the end user For many use cases, BitTorrent is a superior file distribution mechanism compared to centralized alternatives.

BT, as a community, is actually being challenged by cheap streaming services, like Netflix, Spotify, Youtube, Steam, etc. They are so cheap and convenient that even simple torrenting feels very slow and cumbersome.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#108

Post by jsemrau »

bee_rider wrote: post #91
endisneigh wrote: post #5

I don’t understand what problem web3 can solve that a trusted entity cannot. And let’s keep in mind your reply to this comment will be using a trusted entity. In fact in the history of the internet I cannot find a single example of any technology working better in a decentralized fashion compared to centralized for the end user

The internet was better before Social Media, but I guess that was a kind of different decentralization.

While I agree with you that the Internet was better before Social Media, these service are highly centralized. Although, for most normal users decentral or central doesn't really matter.

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#109

Post by jjnoakes »

vmception wrote: post #86
jjnoakes wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get mostly the same features with self-hosted and local traditional apps for a fraction of the price and much lower general financial risk as well.

If blockchain is more expensive than cloud for you, the person that launched the product, then you architected your project wrong Blockchain products are write once, read free, persist forever for free. Your users pay to interact. Every SaaS funnel person knows that of you get users to pay at all then you have filtered the funnel to larger payments already. Blockchakn projects are that funnel in warp speed.

I disagree. The cost of just deploying my contract might pay for years of self hosting at current transaction rates. It might eventually amortize out to cheaper over many, many years, but that assumes no changes are ever needed. How likely is that?

Re: The Web3 Fraud

#110

Post by mannerheim »

endisneigh wrote: post #65
mannerheim wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In fact in the history of the internet I cannot find a single example of any technology working better in a decentralized fashion compared to centralized for the end user Torrents?

You think torrents are a better way to distribute files compared to alternatives?

Depends on what files you're distributing. There are some legal uses that they're a good fit for, but there's no better way to pirate content.
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