Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

japantimes.co.jp

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 382 posts

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#101

Post by ekianjo »

the__alchemist wrote: post #84
pezzana wrote: post #32

> The team, including Juntendo University professor Toru Minamino, confirmed that mice administered with the vaccine showed decreases in the zombie cells, medically known as senescent cells, and in areas affected by arterial stiffening. By now this has become a trope. "Researchers develop new treatment for {UNTREATED_DISEASE}" ... in mice. Mouse models of human disease are very limited in their predictive ability. Th…

This is basic science; early research. Not immediately applicable, and harder for many people to see the benefit, but important. Humans share much fundamental biology with other mammals. Moue tests aren't guaranteed to be directly applicable, but it's what we've got.

> Humans share much fundamental biology with other mammals.

It's like saying a rock and a plant share fundamental atoms with each other. Biology even from one close specie to another is so mindbogglingly unpredictable that we don't have good models. In 2021.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#102

Post by ekianjo »

CorrectHorseBat wrote: post #85
Frost1x wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely. We have a tremendous amount of risk aversion these days and a culture that has disdain for risk, even calculated abstract risks. What many don't realize is being too risk averse comes with its own risks, it also requires accurate risk assessment so you can make the correct decisions on when to take a risk and not. You could lockup in complete fear akin to analysis paralysis where non-zero risk keeps you f…

We are very risk averse of taking vaccines, while they are incredibly safe and barely have any risk associated with them. Probably more harm is done because people are too afraid of taking a vaccine than the opposite (not only looking at covid19 vaccines). The biggest harm done by taking vaccines you don't really need is probably that the money could have been used for something more useful.

> while they are incredibly safe and barely have any risk associated with them

Alternative explanation: nobody knows the risks in details, and side-effects are widely under-reported anyway. Ask any doctor how often they report even serious side effects, you will be very surprised.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#103

Post by catillac »

blip54321 wrote: post #7
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #2

Sign me up for this the second it is available. As an aside, to spite anti vaxxers I’m on a mission to get every vaccine I can. I want my bloodstream to be like the Library at Alexandria before it burned down.

You already have the Library of Alexandria. That's your lymph nodes. What vaccines do is move some books to the front of the building, so your dentritic cells don't have to spend a few days finding them. You want the right books at the front. A mission to move all the books to the front is perhaps misguided.

I’m not sure this is fully accurate, but I would like the analogy of vaccines being like an LRU cache.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#104

Post by majkinetor »

CorrectHorseBat wrote: post #85
Frost1x wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely. We have a tremendous amount of risk aversion these days and a culture that has disdain for risk, even calculated abstract risks. What many don't realize is being too risk averse comes with its own risks, it also requires accurate risk assessment so you can make the correct decisions on when to take a risk and not. You could lockup in complete fear akin to analysis paralysis where non-zero risk keeps you f…

We are very risk averse of taking vaccines, while they are incredibly safe and barely have any risk associated with them. Probably more harm is done because people are too afraid of taking a vaccine than the opposite (not only looking at covid19 vaccines). The biggest harm done by taking vaccines you don't really need is probably that the money could have been used for something more useful.

Barely have any acute risk. Its almost impossible to find out what happens after long time, say a decade, with the current approach.

> The biggest harm done by taking vaccines you don't really need is probably that the money could have been used for something more useful.

What kind of nonsense is that? Its the same as saying "there is no problem in taking any drug, the worst it can get is lose some money". You can't clamp entire technology as good or wrong. Vaccine as technology obviously has merit. Any particular vaccine may be problematic or not. Think H1N1 and narcolepsy, anthrax vaccine in gulf war etc.

This kind of trash talk is exactly the same as anti-vax talk. I have no sympathy for either clan. As usual, people convert complex topic into binary decision which is madness.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#105

Post by kiba »

CorrectHorseBat wrote: post #85
Frost1x wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely. We have a tremendous amount of risk aversion these days and a culture that has disdain for risk, even calculated abstract risks. What many don't realize is being too risk averse comes with its own risks, it also requires accurate risk assessment so you can make the correct decisions on when to take a risk and not. You could lockup in complete fear akin to analysis paralysis where non-zero risk keeps you f…

We are very risk averse of taking vaccines, while they are incredibly safe and barely have any risk associated with them. Probably more harm is done because people are too afraid of taking a vaccine than the opposite (not only looking at covid19 vaccines). The biggest harm done by taking vaccines you don't really need is probably that the money could have been used for something more useful.

That's why if you hadn't done your homework, I believe you should just follow the recommendation of your doctor and/or the CDC.

They likely laid all the groundwork for you in term of cost/benefit.

But there's no point in blindly taking vaccines for the sake of taking vaccines and increasing your risk of becoming part of the fatality statistics.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#106

Post by juanani »

bool3max wrote: post #82
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #2

Sign me up for this the second it is available. As an aside, to spite anti vaxxers I’m on a mission to get every vaccine I can. I want my bloodstream to be like the Library at Alexandria before it burned down.

You sound as if your mental capacity is severely limited.

Signalling pride in your own ignorance is effective trolling. One can always hide behind that one razor.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#107

Post by sva_ »

rmbyrro wrote: post #88
netizen-936824 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Because they get experimented on and then slaughtered by the thousands

At least some get lucky and sometimes slow down aging - for example - when things work out. I don't want to think about what the others go through when things go wrong, though...

Pretty sure they'll still get killed once the experiment is completed.

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#109

Post by NullPrefix »

DeWilde wrote: post #36
ralusek wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vaccines are also, themselves, not exactly GOOD for you. They're just eliciting an immune response in order to obtain immunological defense at a theoretically/hopefully lower cost than the alternative infection. Subjecting yourself to immune response, which for some vaccines can have high amount of reactogenicity, is having your body undergo heavy inflammation, a fair amount of tissue damage, etc. The people that jus…

I have a rare condition related to insulin resistance and diabetes, blood sugar spikes greatly worsen my health. Discovered that vaccines spike sugar prety significantly after getting my two shots this year. Won't be getting boosters anytime soon as the side effects were gruesome.

Wouldn't that make you an antivaxxer? You surely don't want to be mixed up with that crowd, do you?

Re: Japanese scientists develop vaccine to eliminate cells behind aging

#110

Post by tux3 »

mmastrac wrote: post #87
tux3 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have antibodies that will bind to just about anything foreign, including viruses that your body has never seen before, M-type immunoglobulin (IgM). It's the kind of antibodies that responds in the first phases of an infection. The problem is that IgMs are not very specific. They bind to a lot of things, but they bind poorly. In the library of Alexandria analogy, it's like a book that happens to mention a subject…

Is there a good resource to learn more about this without a Biology degree? I always assumed the body generated matching snippets at random and the law of large numbers would result in a match eventually.

>Is there a good resource to learn more about this without a Biology degree? Immunology is complicated. Some people call it the second most complicated system, behind the human brain.

Someone else has mentioned the Kurzgesagt resources, which are great. If you want something more formal, OME is also a great resource I think.

https://onlinemeded.org/spa/immunology

>I always assumed the body generated matching snippets at random and the law of large numbers would result in a match eventually.

Right. Antibodies have a Y shape, where the two tips of the Y are variable, and the base is fixed. The IgM are the completely random snippets that happen to match a wide variety of things. However, because it's chemistry, it's more subtle than match or no match. Think of it like a variable degree of stickiness.

When a pathogen is found, your body is going to iteratively mutate new antibodies and select those that bind the best to the collected antigens, until you have something very specific (= sticks very readily). I'm simplifying a little bit, but that's the process for generating IgGs that I was talking about.

Post reply on HN