Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules • Hacker News Board

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#631

Post by joshuamorton » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:28 PM UTC

nickysielicki wrote: post #619

space_fountain wrote: post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well that is the claim that Assange is making. The government claims he tangibly helped. That has always been the line. You can't give your source burglary tools, ask them to break into something particular and then claim you were just a reporter. You may believe the claims from the prosecution are wrong or lies, but they don't seem on their surface to be crazy

> You can't give your source burglary tools, ask them to break into something particular and then claim you were just a reporter. Drop the analogy, what did Assange actually do to help Manning? I’d maintain that it’s not unreasonable for a journalist to ask a leaker for documents about a particular topic.

Presumably this will be addressed at the trial, and a jury will decide whether the materialness of the assistance was criminal.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#632

Post by HPsquared » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:29 PM UTC

kstenerud wrote: post #204

This should be a sobering view of how the world really works. Above a certain threshold, every veneer of civilization vanishes no matter what the country (some have a higher threshold than others). At this level, only power matters. And the first rule of power is: Don't embarrass the powerful unless you can call on a lot of power to defend yourself. Laws can't protect you; they can be thwarted and bent, and the legal…

People think (and have throughout history thought) that they live outside of history and "this time it's different".

Hard to see the forest for the trees, I suppose

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#633

Post by nickysielicki » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

joshuamorton wrote: post #631

nickysielicki wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't give your source burglary tools, ask them to break into something particular and then claim you were just a reporter. Drop the analogy, what did Assange actually do to help Manning? I’d maintain that it’s not unreasonable for a journalist to ask a leaker for documents about a particular topic.

Presumably this will be addressed at the trial, and a jury will decide whether the materialness of the assistance was criminal.

Of course, but that doesn’t mean we can’t talk about it in the interim. My parent comment claims (through analogy) that Assange gave secret proprietary hacking tools to Manning. I don’t believe that’s remotely true.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#634

Post by fredstarr » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

shadowgovt wrote: post #502

fredstarr wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Overcorrection? No it is not. They enjoy misleading and diverting attention away from the things that really matter. Just take a look at these lawsuits: https://greenwald.substack.com/p/a-court-ruled-rachel-maddow... https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-karen-mcdougal-case... Look, these talking heads are simply well-paid entertainers - nothing more. All they spew is lies, propaganda and downplay the things that…

Of course, the problem with removing First Amendment protections is you only know about these lawsuits because Business Insider and Glenn Greenwald enjoy First Amendment protections. That having been said: the First Amendment is not absolute, and there are exceptions to the general principle that people are free to say what they feel (Assange, for example, could be tried on espionage if he's extradited). But in gener…

Y'all are really taking this shit serious! LMAO. I think my own First Amendment rights should be revoked, actually! LOL

Jokes aside, I'm against censorship. I think information should be available to all but maybe with caveats and accountability.

BTW, I agree with the proposed remedies. But - Who's gonna bell the cat though? It ain't going to be any of y'all's Senators, CongressPeople or the Executive Branch. And we all know for damn sure that it's never going to be the Supreme Court.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#635

Post by tootie » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:33 PM UTC

ianhawes wrote: post #317

tootie wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dispute him being a journalist. He hosts a website for raw intel that is frequently stolen.

NYT, WP, ProPublica, etc all “host a website for raw intel that is frequently stolen”.

They will always vet, synthesize, secure and edit their material. That's what makes it journalism. There's a reason Snowden went to The Guardian and not WikiLeaks.

Julian Assange is as much of a journalist as Mark Zuckerberg is.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#636

Post by Dah00n » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #473

kstenerud wrote: post #204

This should be a sobering view of how the world really works. Above a certain threshold, every veneer of civilization vanishes no matter what the country (some have a higher threshold than others). At this level, only power matters. And the first rule of power is: Don't embarrass the powerful unless you can call on a lot of power to defend yourself. Laws can't protect you; they can be thwarted and bent, and the legal…

Your entire post is opinion and contains no information, factual or otherwise.

So, just like yours? How does this add anything?

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#637

Post by shadowgovt » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

lettergram wrote: post #183

To fully appreciate the context: - he’s not a us citizen - none of the “crimes” happened on US soil - he’s a world famous journalist with prior work - was charged with bogus crimes in Europe in an attempt to arrest him. All dropped - the person who stole the files he released is already free and the tax payers paid for their transition

We're witnessing the difference between someone who faces justice head-on (Manning) and someone who spends a decade evading a court.

The justice system can determine a person's guilt or innocence, but only when they're brought before it. The enforcement system may, depending on their cost / benefit analysis, spend disproportionate resources to make that happen.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#638

Post by njarboe » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

ceejayoz wrote: post #389

mercy_dude wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is the way founding fathers envisioned first amendment protection, they never foresaw the rise of a small billionaires oligarchs owning large stake of media and newspapers to promote views favouring their narratives. I am not speaking of first amendment of individuals which I think is also under attack by the same group of people, look how the mainstream media would love to cancel certain people they don’t l…

The idea that people who lived in a time of tarring-and-feathering people couldn't anticipate cancel culture is a bit silly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Brown_(loyalist) > Brown requested the liberty to hold his own opinions, saying that he could "never enter into an Engagement to take up arms against the Country which gave him being", and finally met their demands with pistol and sword. The crowd seized him…

What I find inspiring about the Boston massacre is that founding father, John Adams, defended the British soldiers involved in it and doing so did not prevent him from becoming president in the future. The values of the electorate were quite a bit different in those days and really are knowing about and emulating the better parts.

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#639

Post by Dah00n » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:35 PM UTC

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #554

boomboomsubban wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They openly admit their willingness to break all three if "future acts" deem them necessary, not to mention they're free to stick him in another terrible jail with other restrictive measures even with the assurances.

Hello old friend. Why are you outraged about things that have not happened? Has the US Govt broken those promises? Y/n?

yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

Re: Julian Assange can be extradited to the US, court rules

#640

Post by shadowgovt » Fri, Dec 10, 2021, 7:36 PM UTC

fredstarr wrote: post #634

shadowgovt wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, the problem with removing First Amendment protections is you only know about these lawsuits because Business Insider and Glenn Greenwald enjoy First Amendment protections. That having been said: the First Amendment is not absolute, and there are exceptions to the general principle that people are free to say what they feel (Assange, for example, could be tried on espionage if he's extradited). But in gener…

Y'all are really taking this shit serious! LMAO. I think my own First Amendment rights should be revoked, actually! LOL Jokes aside, I'm against censorship. I think information should be available to all but maybe with caveats and accountability. BTW, I agree with the proposed remedies. But - Who's gonna bell the cat though? It ain't going to be any of y'all's Senators, CongressPeople or the Executive Branch. And we…

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

... emphasis on the last part.