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Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

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Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#51

Post by II2II »

darkwater wrote: post #42
api wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been programming since... well... technically since I was a kid in the 1980s and professionally since 1998. I think several areas have regressed quite a bit. The biggest one by far is desktop GUI programming. From the late 1980s until the mid-2000s GUIs had all kinds of standardized visual cues, context sensitive help, UIs usable by both mouse and keyboard, standard interface designs across apps, data binding, a…

How comes that circa 2000 VB6 was the most hated and belittled programming language out there? I was there, I remember it. Now it's suddenly part of the golden age of desktop programming? I think you should put your nostalgia glasses off.

It's for much the same reason that BASIC (in general) was maligned and people wax nostalgic for it today. A lot of people cut their teeth on it, may that be learning how to program or embarking upon a career in programming. In other words, they have much to be thankful for.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#52

Post by bobthechef »

hnmullany wrote: post #25
rozab wrote: post #11

Jonathan Blow's talk 'Preventing the Collapse of Civilization' goes into detail about how technology can regress, with the Mechanism being one example. This kind of thing is far more common than we think, most would be surprised to learn that Ancient Greece had writing for about 600 years before forgetting it. There was no writing in Greece for over 400 years, until they adopted the Phoenician alphabet around 730 BC.…

Same way - the extended 3rd century crisis in the Roman Empire led to a loss of sculpting expertise. No art was commissioned for so long that skills weren't passed on.

An example closer to home, though perhaps not as stark, is the loss of expertise in various industries that have been outsourced. The US is a good example. This is one (of many) arguments against outsourcing your industry just because it's cheaper and increases the profits of the outsourcing company. The tradition and culture that allows a certain industry to flourish is interrupted and destroyed and rebuilding that is no small task.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#53

Post by chiefalchemist »

luma wrote: post #4
smitty1e wrote: post #3

"Simply shouldn't exist" Pyramids were wonders of the ancient world long before the Python web framework. The condescencion of the modern age toward those who came before use never ceases to amuse.

All they're saying is that the technology represented in this device has no equivalent in the historical record anywhere near that time and that place. It's not to say that it literally cannot exist, rather, our historical understanding of these peoples is clearly incomplete. These are the sorts of findings that change our understanding of history which makes it pretty exciting to me. The Clickspring series on this m…

> our historical understanding of these peoples is clearly incomplete

That's the point being made.The conventional wisdom lens frames them as inferior, instead of us being the ones who are flawed.

There's a difference between "They couldn't have done that..." and "We didn't realize they could have done it."

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#54

Post by ceejayoz »

rozab wrote: post #11

Jonathan Blow's talk 'Preventing the Collapse of Civilization' goes into detail about how technology can regress, with the Mechanism being one example. This kind of thing is far more common than we think, most would be surprised to learn that Ancient Greece had writing for about 600 years before forgetting it. There was no writing in Greece for over 400 years, until they adopted the Phoenician alphabet around 730 BC.…

One of the interesting possibilities for the Fermi Paradox is the fact that we've wiped out the readily accessible deposits of iron, coal, oil, etc. A second go at the industrial revolution would be much harder, if we regressed that far.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#55

Post by ZanyProgrammer »

darkerside wrote: post #36
wheelerof4te wrote: post #12

Just think abput all the knowledge that was lost over the centuries and millenia of human civilization. Who are we to think that our technology is the greatest and the most advanced on this planet? We have no conclusive evidence to claim such titles. Ancient people have drawings of strange creatures and devices that descend from the heavens. Even the Pyramids show signs of advanced engineering, such as deep tunnels a…

This is generally considered a dangerous line of thinking, but I believe society has become too soft. We're so frightened of mystical thinking and being wrong that people aren't willing to entertain "dumb" ideas. Just don't make the mistake of thinking it's anything more than speculation.

> We're so frightened of mystical thinking and being wrong that people aren't willing to entertain "dumb" ideas.

As the pandemic has showed, quite the contrary we embrace too many "dumb" ideas.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#56

Post by bzzzt »

ale42 wrote: post #47
darkwater wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How comes that circa 2000 VB6 was the most hated and belittled programming language out there? I was there, I remember it. Now it's suddenly part of the golden age of desktop programming? I think you should put your nostalgia glasses off.

I think that the most hated part of VB6 was more the BASIC language rather than the GUI design part... but maybe I'm wrong.

I think it had more to do with VB being so easy it attracted lots of inexperienced programmers who didn't care about performance or correctness as long as the job got done. Sort of like a pre-internet PHP ;)

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#57

Post by tragomaskhalos »

As a kid I was really into the whole 'ancient mysteries' thing and wrote about the Antikythera mechanism in gushing / awed tones in my English O-level ! Luckily the examiner was kind, but years later I realise it must have come across as all a bit Von Daniken.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#59

Post by samsin »

throwawayay02 wrote: post #19

It is absolutely not a computer, though. They observed the observable astrological phenomena was cyclical and made a system of gears for their periods to predict it's state. It's interesting, but for context it is centuries younger than the first Greek geared clocks, so it's definitely not something we should be too surprised that existed.

I had a similar thought and I noticed it wasn’t referred to in the video as a computer, only the title. I’d describe it as a model although I think it fits the common definition of a computer too.

Re: Antikythera Mechanism: An ancient 'computer' that 'shouldn't exist' [video]

#60

Post by vmception »

Because of the backwards things occurring on the other side of the Mediterranean?

Weird standard. Its like a historian researching Iraq in the year 4,050 AD and also finding a ancient semiconductor factory in Austria saying “huh, that shouldn't exist”

On today’s timeless news, group of wandering nomads hopes for religious nation state, more at 11!

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