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Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

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Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#141
post #27

Wait FF is copying this too?!?

Safari had the same concept first.

Yep. But note that MV3 is a lot more powerful than Safari's adblocking capabilities. It's still declarative, but supports dynamic rules, header modification, etc.

https://developer.chrome.com/docs/extensions/reference/decla...

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#142

It will be interesting what Microsoft will do, at first glance they don't care about advertisement and allowing ad-block would bring a lot of users to their ecosystem. (they already have soft adblock out of the box)

That probably because their operating system is infested with advertisements and data exfiltration mechanisms. Why would they need the browser to do it too?

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#143
post #26

The security argument seems pretty simple. The end goal is that legit extensions that people regularly install should not need to ask for dangerous permissions, because a) it teaches the users that it's normal and b) since the extensions can become compromised later and abuse the permissions. Adblockers are probably the most common kind of extension, and are currently granted effectively unlimited access to read and…

I, as an end user want to be able to install whatever dangerous software I want, especially as a power user. I understand the potential consequences and I don't want or need the handrails. Options and freedom are good. This is why browsers need to be split off from for profit organizations to be managed by entities that aren't concerned with the fallout if someone installs malicious software.

I don't think this is a great path, though. Extensions like uBlock Origin should not only be available to people like us, who understand the risk of giving extensions more permissions, and would (hypothetically) have to click through some scary warning dialogs or edit config files to allow it. Your average-Joe user probably needs extensions like this even more than we do in order to remain secure on the web.

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#144
post #47

I miss the early days of Firefox extensions (circa 2004) where an extension could in very powerful ways completely change the layout/functionality of your browser; when they had near unlimited access to the XUL and could change anything and everything. I used a ton of very useful extensions then. Nested tabs were one of my favorites. These days I've got a password manager, a bookmark checker, and a tab manager I wrot…

Take a look at http://nyxt.atlas.engineer/ . It's written to be extensible/introspectable, and the extension language is Common Lisp.

I tried installing Nyxt. I'm not sure how common CUA bindings are. I tried pressing Alt+Left and Alt+Right to navigate between pages, but got a strange error in the status bar: "Warning: Error on separate thread: There is no applicable method for the generic function # when called with arguments (NIL). See also: The ANSI Standard, Section 7.6.6". Which is baffling as a user.

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#145
post #11

If Google actually gave a crap about security, they would let you disable extensions. As it is, I have to routinely delete malicious extensions from every family member's Chromebook. Lord knows how they get there, but they always do. Since this new standard still lets extensions observe everything, I don't see what the point is.

This wouldn't happen with proper adblockers. Also, if a user or a malicious script has permission to install extensions, I assume it would also have permission to toggle "enable extensions" setting.

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#146
> “ It’s also doubtful Mv3 will do much for security. Firefox maintains the largest extension market that’s not based on Chrome, and the company has said it will adopt Mv3 in the interest of cross-browser compatibility.”

I don’t understand why Firefox needs to adopt Mv3 for “cross-browser compatibility”. Is this to save extension writers time and effort or is it a mistake in the article?

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it Chromium based? It might be great but for now refuse to support anything that further strengthen Googles grip on the market.

I've been using Firefox for as long as I've been on the internet, but I got really tired of using it just because "It's not chromium". Mozilla been doing really stupid and frustrating decisions that made me feel like I'm in an abusive relationship. I've been eyeballing Vivaldi for a long time, and Firefox breaking compact mode finally broke the camel's back for me earlier this year. When I switched to Vivaldi I felt…

I've fully moved to vivaldi too, having my emails, notes, calendar all in my browser makes life so much easier.

Vivaldi also has an amazing history page.

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean you can, but firefox doesn't treat you any better. We waited 2+ months to get a minor update through review, and getting it through that quickly took emailing several folks (including one from HN). During that whole process they also removed the display of your queue position, making it even more opaque. At some point they disliked something in our extension that had been live for months, and disabled every re…

At this point I am seriously wondering if Mozilla is paid to drive Firefox into the ground.

This does feel like it is the case doesn't it?

I really want to like firefox but I hate it more with every release.

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What will Brave, Vivaldi, etc, do when Google makes some change that breaks the current APIs? Do they have the resources and are willing to continue to support them?

FWIW, Brave does.

Brave's long-term problem is that Google can set the cost of Brave's ongoing maintenance to whatever they want. In the 90s Microsoft called this "keeping the competition on a treadmill".

Re: Chrome users beware: Manifest v3 is deceitful and threatening

#150
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You realize Firefox only exists because it serves Google's interests right? And while Brave might be based on Chromium, it is distinct; in addition to not crippling nativewebrequest as chrome will, it's native adblocker is compatible with the same lists as ublock origin. So I would go with Brave :)

If Google is not able to control ad-blocking because all the Chromium clones refuse to play ball, what do you think they will do? I have no idea. Maybe just close Chromium entirely, and force all the clones to shut down since there's no way they have the engineering resources to keep up with Google. EDIT: Except for MSFT... that would be interesting for sure.

Microsoft already switched to Chromium because they decided not to devote engineering resources to keep up with Google.
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