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Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

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Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#131

Post by olyjohn »

brianwawok wrote: post #89
dragontamer wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk to any Tesla-fan. "Icky ICE Engine". "Now you have two engines with twice the malfunctions". "I don't like oil changes". Etc. etc. They're incredibly anti-PHEV. Neither Elon nor his gang of supporters are very good for PHEVs. And on stage, Elon still derides them as a strategy. -------- Look: Elon / Tesla are right now arguing __against__ government incentives for PHEVs and EVs. His politics have flipped. He's n…

I am both a Tesla fan and a Tesla driver. I am against PHEVs. When my parents recently went shopping for a new car, I tried to sell BEV. When I failed, I encouraged them to skip PHEV and just buy ICE. PHEV are 2x the complexity and things to worry about and go wrong. You need to stop for gas AND plug in your car every day? You need to change your oil AND potentially replace your battery? IMO PHEV exist because they a…

Is a PHEV any more complicated than a regular hybrid car? You still have gas and electric motors, just a bigger battery pack in the PHEV. The Prius has proven that even with a gas motor, they can be super reliable. These cars are beaten and abused by taxi fleets and Uber drivers for over 20 years now, and they still hit over 300,000 miles reliably. The electric motor takes so much work off of the gas motor, the gas motor is still usually in really good condition after that many miles.

And if you buy the right PHEV, like as in, you buy the one that fits your commute, you probably don't have to gas up much at all. I know people with PHEVs and they love them. They rarely ever put gas in them, except for long trips. All their commuting is done on electric power. They work great. I don't really get what you are on about.

Maybe you are biased as a Tesla fan and Tesla driver. I mean, I'm not even sure why else you would have mentioned that. Maybe as a disclaimer that we will know your post is biased? The fact that you're a fan has nothing to do with the reliability or quality of a PHEV, and is totally irrelevant otherwise.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#132

Post by dragontamer »

olyjohn wrote: post #131
brianwawok wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am both a Tesla fan and a Tesla driver. I am against PHEVs. When my parents recently went shopping for a new car, I tried to sell BEV. When I failed, I encouraged them to skip PHEV and just buy ICE. PHEV are 2x the complexity and things to worry about and go wrong. You need to stop for gas AND plug in your car every day? You need to change your oil AND potentially replace your battery? IMO PHEV exist because they a…

Is a PHEV any more complicated than a regular hybrid car? You still have gas and electric motors, just a bigger battery pack in the PHEV. The Prius has proven that even with a gas motor, they can be super reliable. These cars are beaten and abused by taxi fleets and Uber drivers for over 20 years now, and they still hit over 300,000 miles reliably. The electric motor takes so much work off of the gas motor, the gas m…

In fact, PHEVs are arguably simpler, because the engine is tuned to the generator (which has a consistent RPM / Torque curve).

Having an engine run at one singular RPM / Torque band is much easier than ICE, which commonly needs to deliver power from ~1500 RPM to 6000 RPM.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#133

Post by dragontamer »

VBprogrammer wrote: post #77
dragontamer wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk to any Tesla-fan. "Icky ICE Engine". "Now you have two engines with twice the malfunctions". "I don't like oil changes". Etc. etc. They're incredibly anti-PHEV. Neither Elon nor his gang of supporters are very good for PHEVs. And on stage, Elon still derides them as a strategy. -------- Look: Elon / Tesla are right now arguing __against__ government incentives for PHEVs and EVs. His politics have flipped. He's n…

I mean, the whole two engines thing is true though right? If someone else can get the cost of H2 fuel cells down to a marketable level I'm sure Tesla would be very happy to fit them as optional range extenders to its next line up. In the UK at least, most PHEVs sold are cynically avoiding a bunch of taxes and benefit in kind. Many of them are never plugged into a charger.

> If someone else can get the cost of H2 fuel cells down to a marketable level I'm sure Tesla would be very happy to fit them as optional range extenders to its next line up.

Hyundai Xcient for one is launching imminently.

China / Zhangjiakou is launching 600+ busses on Hydrogen for the 2022 Winter Games.

Toyota Mirai existed for __years__.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#134

Post by diebeforei485 »

dragontamer wrote: post #120
kiba wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hydrogen Fuel Cells and probably more widespread PHEVs. I am unconvinced by the case for hydrogen fuel cells or PHEVs. 10-million cars with 200lbs of Li-ion batteries each would save more energy from our transportation network than 2-million cars with 1000lbs of Li-ion batteries each. The correct answer is the reduction of cars. Taking 10 million cars off the road and switching to public transit and higher density su…

Mr. Musk was pretty integral in his role of killing the California High Speed Rail project. He created a fake solution, the Hyperloop, to steal hype away, and then never built the Hyperloop. Thereby killing the mass-transit solution of California. ------ I stand by my assertion. Mr. Musk is no longer useful for the environmental cause. He is decidedly anti-progress at this point. A few years ago it was somewhat ambig…

Nonsense. California High Speed Rail practically killed itself.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#135

Post by kiba »

ghaff wrote: post #122
kiba wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The better solution is just to get rid of car and use trains and bikes more. Trains don't require FSD and yet they're incredibly safe. FSD exists only because we built our entire society around cars.

So people are only allowed to live or visit places with sufficient density that you're in cycling distance of a train station? (And heaven help you if you can't cycle for some reason.) Even in countries with good train service and lots of cycling, this certainly isn't the case today. Good luck locking everyone up into urban areas.

The only reason why we were able to live the car oriented lifestyle we have is because we decided to subsidize and build roads for mass market cars. This doesn't preclude the existence of streetcar suburbs with walkable neighborhoods, and it isn't so bad once you realize that cars generate a whole lot of noise, especially the faster they run.

Long distance journey can be facilitated by interurban rails and railroads.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#136

Post by diebeforei485 »

dragontamer wrote: post #50
tbabb wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was the requirement that was satisfied by the battery swap?

California wrote an idiotic tax credit that gave +tax credits to vehicles that demonstrated a capacity to charge in under X minutes. Elon Musk shows off a battery swap demo on stage to "prove" it, and then grabbed the tax credit. Then he threw away the battery swap demo and never talked about it again. Its a combination of idiotic governance + a conman / liar at work. The government tax credit is a decent idea to spu…

Not true, they did have a real battery swap station just off i-5 (between SF and LA) near Kettleman City. I don't think many people used it, however.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#137

Post by rootusrootus »

y4mi wrote: post #108
rootusrootus wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've driving a lot farther than 60 miles without disengaging. Many thousands of miles without ever once panic braking for a shadow. Even average drivers die about once every 100 million miles. AP is so far from that it isn't fair to try and compare. And that's just average drivers, which includes drunks, tired people, 16 year olds, weather-related accidents, etc. Put AP or FSD up against a normal, sober driver in dec…

and you think 60 miles without disenganging on a freeway means anything? to quote wikipedias statistic from 2012: - the United States had 3.38 road fatalities per 1 billion vehicle-km on its Interstate-type highways, often called freeways.[28] congrats on your 60 miles i guess... only 295 857 928 more miles until your car performs as well as an average human from 2012.

Pretty sure you meant to quote the comment I replied to, because it sounds like you agree with me.

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#138

Post by r00fus »

dragontamer wrote: post #118
r00fus wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fuel Cells are the scam. The cheapest way to make hydrogen fuel is through fracking. It's dirty under the top-level. So it's "no emissions" but still relies on the planet-killing petroleum fuel chain. If you think PHEVs are somehow constrained by EVs - you have no idea of the patent forests Toyota and others have built on hybrid tech. It's not the lithium that's stopping PHEVs.

And the cheapest source of electricity is coal. So its not like your EV-powered vehicle (largely using coal to power itself) is much better. In any case, widespread electrolysis of Hydrogen is well researched and well on its way to being achieved: https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-production-el... There was a good article or two on some systems developed that were direct from solar-power into hydrogen, s…

Coal isn't the cheapest power anymore. Your information is out of date [1]. Electrolysis or solar hydrogen production still isn't even here, much less cheaper than fracking.

[1] https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/07/renewables-cheapest-e...

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#139

Post by diebeforei485 »

dragontamer wrote: post #31
toomuchtodo wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solar roof was on a brewery in New England I recently patroned. You can buy it if you want to pay and wait for it. Battery swaps were to fully capture California ZEV credits until Tesla could grow large enough to not rely on them. The market for Teslas has flourished without them, relying only on Fast DC chargers for consumer range anxiety. Personal assistant robot is a cheap marketing effort to drive recruiting of t…

> Laugh and point fingers. The methods work, regardless of the feelings about them. No. "Battery Swap" was a lie that was never delivered and frankly just stole money from California. We all know that __lying__ works. The last few years have made it abundantly clear that the general population is far more accepting of these lies than I'm comfortable for. So I'm going to keep pointing them out.

> "Battery Swap" was a lie that was never delivered

Sorry, but this can be disproved with a single Google search. They did have a battery swap station (between SF and LA), but there was minimal interest from customers.

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-shuts-down-battery-swap-prog...

Re: Tesla Update Allows Video Games While Driving, and the Feds Aren’t Happy

#140

Post by [deleted] »

dragontamer wrote: post #16
hef19898 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Classic populist modus operadi. Push the pendulum to one extreme and move the perceived middle ground along. He does the same with goal posts and timelines. I have to give it to him so, he gets away with it for years now. And he ultimately delivers product, something most Musk-wannabes fail to do.

> And he ultimately delivers product, something most Musk-wannabes fail to do. Where's are the solar roof? Battery swaps? And "coast-to-coast full self driving", $35,000 Model 3? Do you think the personal assistant robot will ever be a delivered product? ------- Musk has mastered the ability to make the public forget about his promises. He doesn't deliver on these promises at all. I think we're generally wising up to…

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