What happens when they grow up and make something illegal for you in return?
"something" that can cause lung cancer? I guess it's just going to save lives.
New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
11–20 of 162 posts
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#12I like this. It's certainly more possible in New Zealand than in a corporate-owned country like the USA.
That's the least of the reasons it wouldn't work in the USA. It would be a civil rights issue. Age discrimination.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#13Sidestepping questions of personal freedom, I think the method here is interesting. No one will have their access to buy cigarettes taken away. Some people will never receive the access in the first place. It’s easier to not grant access than to grant it, then take it away. I wonder if this could have other legal applications.
Voting, freedom of movement, free speech . . . the possibilities are endless. New Zealand is certainly on the vanguard of this sort of political innovation.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#14I like this. It's certainly more possible in New Zealand than in a corporate-owned country like the USA.
I will have you know our corporate overlords own a good chunk of New Zealand also and any resistance is futile!
But what's up with Jacinda? Is she afraid of Maori adults, why not just ban tobacco entirely?
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#15I fully support this, but sadly there will be kids to whom possession and the smoking of cigarettes will be even more a sign of the utmost coolness. And, as I understand it there will be a time when a 35 year old can buy cigarettes but a 34 year old can't. That's going to be interesting.
Do you support cannabis being illegal? This is a pretty similar stance. Personally, I don’t think tobacco should be illegal. Do I partake? No. But I certainly don’t want to jail people for partaking.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#16soon we'll own our lives to some 'benign' all knowledgeable government...I guess it's where everything is heading, all needs to be measured, assessed, risks calculated, resources optimized.. and nobody seems to be too worried, maybe it's just evolution in action... quite terrifying if you ask me.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#17The price increases (10% per year since 2011) have created a market for stolen and counterfeit cigarettes already. Creating a slow-roll prohibition will not stop people wanting to smoke tobacco products - in fact, previous evidence (e.g. alcohol and cannabis as things most people know about) shows that people are motivated to partake by the very idea of it being illicit.
The product of US prohibition was the creation of extremely wealthy alcohol running families who are nowadays big (legitimate) businesses in North America, built up through the wealth of the illegal operations during prohibition.
While the intention (zero smoking) would save many from suffering horrible deaths, observation of basic human motivation suggests the NZ experiment is more likely to make a few people extremely wealthy and not actually stop tobacco smoking at all, no matter how much better off people would be by not smoking.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#18Sidestepping questions of personal freedom, I think the method here is interesting. No one will have their access to buy cigarettes taken away. Some people will never receive the access in the first place. It’s easier to not grant access than to grant it, then take it away. I wonder if this could have other legal applications.
I think it's a step in the direction of personal freedom, because addictive substances are kinda the opposite of free will.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#19Sidestepping questions of personal freedom, I think the method here is interesting. No one will have their access to buy cigarettes taken away. Some people will never receive the access in the first place. It’s easier to not grant access than to grant it, then take it away. I wonder if this could have other legal applications.
>I wonder if this could have other legal applications.
Not in any country that believes in equality before the law; the concept is that you're not allowed to create 2 classes of citizens, which is what this law effectively does.
Not that the US is at all perfect in this regard, and nearly every state establishes some form of this, but effectively making a group of citizens permanent children should be troubling to anyone who values the concept of equality before the law.
Re: New Zealand plans to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes – for life
#20I fully support this, but sadly there will be kids to whom possession and the smoking of cigarettes will be even more a sign of the utmost coolness. And, as I understand it there will be a time when a 35 year old can buy cigarettes but a 34 year old can't. That's going to be interesting.
I can't support any legislation that so blatantly discriminates against a whole class of people. People should be treated equally in the eyes of the law.