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Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

reuters.com

71–80 of 106 posts

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Publishing the story is itself an editorial decision.

Are you asking for self-censorship of facts?

From the GP:

> Two people having breakthrough infections for any variant is not at all unlikely

The point is that this fact isn't newsworthy... unless Reuters is running an agenda. This article is blatant fearmongering.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you asking for self-censorship of facts?

From the GP: > Two people having breakthrough infections for any variant is not at all unlikely The point is that this fact isn't newsworthy... unless Reuters is running an agenda. This article is blatant fearmongering.

News is a two way street. People want to stay informed about Coronavirus, Reuters is happy to run stories on the topic. They've probably got a few editors focused on the topic, and maybe today was what you might call a "slow news day" in the industry. You can't stand in front of the firehose and complain about being wet though.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#73

> The two doctors had received three doses of the Pfizer/BioNtech vaccine, and so far have shown mild COVID-19 symptoms, the hospital said. The mildness of the symptoms is just as newsworthy as the fact that there are breakthrough infections. It has long been speculated that COVID-19 would evolve into more contagious but less virulent variants. Omicron may be one such variant. If it is, that's probably a good thing.…

> Wouldn't it be great if a vaccinated person could get omicron, have a mild illness, and then have even stronger immunity against other variants?

That would be great, but it appears the immune system does not work that way:

> the body's immune system ... preferentially utilize(s) immunological memory based on a previous infection when a second slightly different version of that foreign pathogen (e.g. a virus or bacterium) is encountered. This leaves the immune system "trapped" by the first response it has made to each antigen, and unable to mount potentially more effective responses during subsequent infections.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_antigenic_sin

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#74
Why is this news other than to create hype? The data always indicated that you can get infected even if you are vaccinated and you can still spread. The only reduction was in severe symptoms and hospitalization. Are these doctors sick and hospitalized or in ICU? This scaremongering is getting very tiring.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a bit on the fence with Vaccine mandates, I wish they weren't necessary. But I get the key reason for them, which you have missed, is it isn't really about the health choices of the person getting vaccinated. If your vaccination status affected no-one but yourself then I would be strongly against any vaccine mandate. If you are unvaccinated you are more likely to get infected, that is your risk. But, if you do g…

What you are describing falls under "discrimination based on perceived disability" which both Canadian Supreme Court and US Supreme Court have repeatedly frowned upon. The Ontario Human Rights Code includes "any degree of infirmity" in the definition of disability. They also recognize that the definition of disability extends to the actual or perceived possibility that a person may develop a disability in the future.…

I know people who aren't vaccinated. You aren't forced to do anything at all. You just can't be expected to be able to do anything you want (go into crowded restaurants for example). Also mps who aren't vaccinated aren't allowed to take their seats in parliament. These are very sound public safety measures.

The statistics on the vaccines are very clear. Misinterpreting the data doesn't change their worldwide objective effectiveness at preventing our hospitals from filling up. Think of it as the same health measures we've put in place against public smoking. You're free to smoke or be unvacced all you want, just don't do it around me, thanks.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bigger fear though is in the unvaccinated. Read news coming out of Israel that R has increased by 1.3x and severity (not sure how that's measured) has increased by 2.4x over Delta [1]. [1] https://tinyurl.com/yckjcmzu

That may turn out to be true but there is absolutely no way they have enough data to make such claims yet. To do so is irresponsible at best

Which is why this story is considered news. People are trying to reassess the risk factor of doing whatever the hell they want. The info has been sparse so far, so we want whatever we can get.

Personally I don't mind sitting inside again for 2-3 weeks while this all gets figured out, but I know I'm in the vast minority by this point.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, it's up to anyone consuming sources to decide for themselves based on available evidence.

Right, but anyone who takes a position yet should be dismissed without prejudice. The default, null hypothesis is that Omicron is exactly as virulent and deadly as the current baseline, Delta. Anything else is bullshit for now and anyone who claims to have data contra that null hypothesis is lying

The problem I see there, and it's the exact reason governments/media/the stock market are all bracing, is that if it's not the way you describe and we keep doing what we're doing (which with Delta has now become next to nothing) it could end up killing 10s of thousands of people. It's important to at least consider that we have a new mutation that needs to be treated differently than the old ones. Be careful out there folks. Wash your hands, wear a mask.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the GP: > Two people having breakthrough infections for any variant is not at all unlikely The point is that this fact isn't newsworthy... unless Reuters is running an agenda. This article is blatant fearmongering.

News is a two way street. People want to stay informed about Coronavirus, Reuters is happy to run stories on the topic. They've probably got a few editors focused on the topic, and maybe today was what you might call a "slow news day" in the industry. You can't stand in front of the firehose and complain about being wet though.

I most certainly can when the person operating the firehose does so under the guise of professional standards where they claim to only use their granted powers to inform, not to convince or persuade. Reuters isn’t like CNN or Fox who hide their prime time talking heads behind some technicality of “entertainment vs news”. Reuters claims to be news, full stop. If they live by that sword they better be prepared to be judged by that sword

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#79

The media really needs to slow their roll, a lot. Two people having breakthrough infections for any variant is not at all unlikely, and this is absolutely not evidence that Omicron is more likely to lead to breakthrough infections. In fact it would only be actually newsworthy if Omicron _didn’t_ break through. And the pointless emotional fact that they are doctors, as if any virus considers ones CV. And the excessive…

As a counterpoint I wonder how many thousands of lives we could have/would have saved if we reported on delta with the same type of urgency. We don't have the facts yet, and every story I've seen underscores that point. But to just say "we don't know so let's ignore it entirely until we do" seems to minimize the deadliness of the past mutations we've seen.

Re: Two Triple Vaccinated Israeli Doctors Infected with Omicron

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but anyone who takes a position yet should be dismissed without prejudice. The default, null hypothesis is that Omicron is exactly as virulent and deadly as the current baseline, Delta. Anything else is bullshit for now and anyone who claims to have data contra that null hypothesis is lying

The problem I see there, and it's the exact reason governments/media/the stock market are all bracing, is that if it's not the way you describe and we keep doing what we're doing (which with Delta has now become next to nothing) it could end up killing 10s of thousands of people. It's important to at least consider that we have a new mutation that needs to be treated differently than the old ones. Be careful out ther…

Yes, we research it, we warn those who are at high risk to be extra cautious but we don’t spread FUD that everyone is going to get reinfected, that the vaccines are useless. You must be able to tell the difference between a cautious but reasonable approach and panic.
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