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2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

cnet.com

171–180 of 183 posts

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I owned a BMW 328i for 20 years. I loved that car dearly. I've now got 94,000 miles on a 2018 Model 3 long range. It's more fun than the BMW in every way. Handles better, accelerates faster, it's much quieter inside. The sound system is much better than the HKs in the BMW. It's more comfortable. I can drive for 4 hours straight with no discomfort. I don't have autopilot cuz my insurance guy wouldn't give me a discoun…

You’re comparing a BMW designed in the late 90s to a brand new car.. If it wasn’t better that would be concerning.

Can you explain what significant improvements BMW have added in the last 20 years? I'm not a car guy but from my perspective, BMWs have only added incremental improvements.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm worried that manufacturers see people accepting Tesla quality and follow suit. I just read an article about Fisker following the "Apple model" where they stay lean and outsource all production. Uh, yeah that's great for a $1,000 phone but when I drop 50x that on a rolling death machine I expect quality to be controlled from end to end and kept in house.

Why? Look at how much Ford outsources.

Other car companies do outsource, but it's tricky. Toyota, for example, invests a ton in building long-term relationships with suppliers. [1] But Toyota is the exception here. The more typical oursourcing relationship is one of low bids and dangerous incentives. As Toyota shows, it's not impossible to get it right. But I think it's reasonable to be concerned.

[1] https://www.stateofflux.co.uk/ideas-insights/case-studies/to...

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#173
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had a lot of friends buy Teslas in the past few years. Exact same story: Faults everywhere, long waits, poor service (albeit super friendly and with a smile). One friend has received his Model 3 back twice now with the problem not fixed at all. He's resigned to just living with the problem until the service backlogs are lower. It has been interesting to see how tolerance for these quality issues has waned as the shin…

The early adopters were True Believers. Elon was changing the world, and to admit any fault was to interfere with The Plan. So they tended exceedingly defensive of Tesla, well past what the outside world considered absurd when they actually admitted the problems. Tesla has expanded outside that market, and to a person who is looking for a more or less reasonable car, that matches other cars in the price bracket, you'…

Elon Musk was the only person willing to build out a whole charging network and that was the biggest factor in the adoption of EVs. That IMO did change the world.

Its possible to love something for its good qualities and accept the bad.

"With historic reliability concerns but an intensely loyal following, Tesla took the top spot for overall owner satisfaction among the 27 brands mentioned in survey responses."[0]

[0]https://www.consumerreports.org/car-reliability-owner-satisf...

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#174
post #69

I have an early build 2018 Model 3 Performance. I have experienced almost zero quality issues. I use Autopilot frequently and have experienced phantom braking maybe 5 times ever in 3+ years, and certainly isn't a deal-breaker. In fact it's improved dramatically since I first got the car. I feel like all I ever hear from outside the Tesla owner bubble is quality issues, complaints, weird problems I've never experience…

Interestingly, the Model 3 actually has a pretty good reputation for reliability. Somehow it's the more expensive models that tend to do worse.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#175
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" I have had issues with it, over the years, but every single time, Tesla stepped up" Is that not the point? The best car you have had, with issues. I have a Honda Fit. It is getting on to fifteen years old now. No issues ever except for wear. But Honda know a lot about making cars. Tesla tried to disrupt the entire process. This is where hubris gets you

"But Honda know a lot about making cars. Tesla tried to disrupt the entire process. This is where hubris gets you " Can you clarify why disrupting the process is hubris? There has been many historical examples of outsiders coming in and improving old processes in many fields. Why is it hubris to disrupt the car manufacturing processes?

1. I am a tech guy who builds computer systems

2. I can comppletely retool car making,

* from base principals

* because I am very smart (see 1.)

That is hubris

Does not always fail. Usually does. Betting on hubris to fail is probably a good strategy (I reckon - I do not know)

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#176
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The idea that the car might randomly override my inputs in error I don’t recall ever saying anything like this happened. My discussion about phantom braking is when autopilot is on. There is no input from me unless I have to or choose to take over. If you don’t want any of the automatic features (autopilot, lane assist, FSD, etc.), they are all trivially easy to turn off or not use. Seriously, just go drive one. Th…

> My discussion about phantom braking is when autopilot is on...trivially easy to turn off Seems odd to have to disable features based, not on one's preferences, but on one's tolerance for errors, especially given that--even without full autopilot enabled--some of those features would be considered active safety features. "This feature can help keep you safe, but it also might make mistakes, so tap here if you don't…

Fwiw, the absolutely bizarre way you’re talking about Teslas in these comments is a narrative.

Your creative narrative here is… interesting.

Best of luck moving forward.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#177
Ok so who has the biggest anecdote? CNET has the platform, and it’s an ad sponsored medium willing to hit pieces for a fee. I just like to argue on the internet for fake points. I recently owned a 2015 Lexus LX570 that engaged emergency seatbelt tensioners (and I think engaged auto braking too?) every time I came across a steel plate road cover for construction. Something about the solid metal hit the radar system just right and caused it to panic. And caused me to damn near have a heart attack every time and swerve, hitting something else. That’s dangerous, and it’s Lexus flagship model. I traded that in for a Model Y.

I have occasionally had phantom braking, and I think the collision warning system is a little frenetic, but phantom braking beats the hell out of phantom acceleration (Ford?), or you know, not braking when it really should (most other late model cars on the road today, and also many new cars currently for sale). I consider it an annoyance but not a safety concern unless there’s some jagweed tailgating me. If you are an appropriately responsive driver with your hands on the wheel and feet ready to engage the pedals, you can trivially override the braking. Only if you tune out does it become a problem. Was the author not safely piloting his vehicle?

The real reason I can tell this is a hit piece is that anyone reviewing the Model Y knows that it’s nearly perfect in every way, maybe a little too expensive, maybe a little cheapish materials in certain areas, but the real massive failure is that the suspension is borderline intolerable on routine city streets. Still thinking about trading it in for that reason alone.

Elon, if you or anyone at Tesla read this, please for the love of all that is good give me an option for variable suspension modes. I got the black turbine wheel upgrade that CNET rightfully said to pass on because, while the look absolutely amazing, I feel like I’ve become one with the asphalt in a bad way. I can’t use the cup holders because my coffees shoot out of the little sip holes at every minor bump. Maybe it’s just me coming from a soggy bottomed LX.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#178
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the Detroit automakers have the same mentality. It's almost like there's this racism belief that the Japanese could never have figured something out that Westerners haven't.

That's not true at all. Here's an article about the reality: https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=125229... Incidentally, it really bothers me that you play the racism card so easily and casually without evidence. Please stop doing that.

GM proceeded to ignore everything that worked at that plant (and still does, nevermind what that article says). They flat out refused to learn from Toyota even when they saw it upfront.

We live in a racist world. You either accept it or be blind to many of the problems of the world.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#179
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My discussion about phantom braking is when autopilot is on...trivially easy to turn off Seems odd to have to disable features based, not on one's preferences, but on one's tolerance for errors, especially given that--even without full autopilot enabled--some of those features would be considered active safety features. "This feature can help keep you safe, but it also might make mistakes, so tap here if you don't…

Fwiw, the absolutely bizarre way you’re talking about Teslas in these comments is a narrative. Your creative narrative here is… interesting. Best of luck moving forward.

>the absolutely bizarre way you’re talking about Teslas in these comments is a narrative.

Yeah, I think what's bizarre here is that your own narrative is so important to you that you can't stomach even the mildest critism of Tesla without feeling personally attacked, or even imagine anyone not having a Tesla "narrative".

So, of course, the fact that you charge people with having a narrative is in itself bizzare. Then, you casually make these odd statements like, "I don't know if you know anyone in real life who has a Tesla", as if it's a unicorn vs. a fairly common motor vehicle.

It's very much a marketing-fueled "us vs. them" worldview you seem to have there around a car. Tesla ownership is clearly an important part of your identity, which may also help explain why you're motoring around with "Autopilot" on and not a care in the world that the vehicle is making errors and braking when it shouldn't.

Best of luck with that. Seriously.

Re: 2021 Tesla Model Y review: Nearly great, critically flawed

#180

I've owned a Model X for a year. It dates from before they removed radar, so autopilot still works very well. The rest of the car, however, does not. It is the least reliable car I have ever known. I am currently tracking ten faults, and waiting for my fifth service, which could only be booked with nearly a month to wait. The most serious faults involve the car sometimes failing to start without a hard reboot first (…

[ slightly edited version of a reply i made a week ago on the CR article]: I have a 2017 Model X that I bought new. The EV part is great, its everything else that sucks. Since I've had it, I've taken it for service for the following: o Arrived w/o Tow pkg (Tesla "forgot" it, was installed via service center appt) o falcon wing doors improperly adjusted, leading to wind noise and water intrusion o Loud wind noise and…

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a38135245/tesla-opens-supe...
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