> ACH payments are generally free to end users in the U.S., though a few banks will attempt to monetize them. (Looking at you, Bank of America.)
Stripe also charges for ACH. ACH payments on Stripe cost 0.80%, capped at $5. [1]
Bank transfers as a payment method
201–210 of 335 posts
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#202Earlier quoted context omitted.
Interestingly, some of the in-person debit card payments I make from my German bank appear to work internally as direct debits. They appear as "SEPA-ELV-LASTSCHRIFT" on statement. Other card payments are just called "KARTENZAHLUNG". Interestingly, the Lastschrift (direct debit) payments seem reversible on my bank interface, so I could get the money back (presumably invoking letters from the company and debt collector…
When using the girocard there's two ways the retailer can take the amount. Either instantly, or using Lastschrift. The latter is cheaper, but the retailer doesn't have the guarantee that your account actually has sufficient balance to pay. If I remember correctly, the latter method requires you to sign the receipt.
Yeah, that's where the fun algorithms trying to predict reliability from the set of products you're buying comes in...
It's getting rarer, though. The cost difference is eroding and signing is too slow for supermarket checkout lanes.
The tables have also turned and some retailers now earn money from the banks for supplying their customers with cash (i. e. you pay by card and get an extra x00 in cash).
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#203It's a no-brainer. Card processing fees are just too high (2.9% + $0.3). Account transfers bring more flexibility and convenience and costs almost nothing.
You can probably get a volume discount on that 2.9% in the US. In Europe, Stripe starts at 1.4% + $0.3 for charging European cards.
You can DEFIANTLY get a volume discount from any credit card processor based on volume. Typical large merchants are paying Interchange Plus at a much lower rate than what's listed on Stripe or Square. Interchange is the rate paid directly to the card issuer and Visa/MC. Plus is paid to the merchant account (Stripe).
The actual itemized fees inside of that Interchange fee are mind boggling.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd have to agree. Everything in the article about Europe is technically correct, but it is such a small slice of the SEPA payments. The article is so misleading it might as well be wrong. I make payments to the benelux, france, germany, spain and poland, and they go all over the push mechanism. Direct debit is for utilities, and that's about it. For fraud, my bank provides a gui with active agreements. While I can't…
> I make payments to the benelux, france, germany, spain and poland, and they go all over the push mechanism. Direct debit is for utilities, and that's about it. SEPA direct debit is a really really popular thing in Germany. Most utilities prefer (quite understandably) to pull from you instead of waiting for your transfer. Even landlords usually give you an agreement form to pull your rent out of your account. I got…
> SEPA direct debit is a really really popular thing in Germany. Most utilities prefer (quite understandably) to pull from you instead of waiting for your transfer. Even landlords usually give you an agreement form to pull your rent out of your account.
Landlords benefit from it because it makes it harder for your to lower your rent in case there are issues with the place that warrant it. If they can withdraw the rent directly, you'd have to undo that payment, pay the lowered amount manually etc. which makes it more hassle for you and also increases the risk of screwing up.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#205When discussing Europe, you can't leave out the rise of mobile payments that work similar to India's UPI. For instance, in Sweden, "Swish"[0] has quickly taken over the market for casual payments, with free, instant, irreversible bank transfers between individuals using only the recipients phone number (or a QR code). They are a bunch of these systems, but currently they are all fractured into national systems, altho…
There is paym in the UK, which works the same way, using phone numbers, but it is not used that much.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#206Does any European bank actually have a public API? My bank (Danske Bank) does not. Even the first step of logging-in with our digital sign-on (NemID) is a bit tricky to automate. (MitID's rsa key fob might make it easier)
https://developers.danskebank.com/ though "Requires a QWAC+QSEAL issued by a QTSP".
(Does any bank anywhere have a truly public API?)
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why this obsession with doing away with a central authority? What is so evil about a central bank? Decentralization is not cheap. I buy a pack of bread from a door-to-door bread and eggs salesman (Yes that's a thing in India). It costs INR 40 ($0.53). I pay him via UPI, he gets money instantly in his bank account with zero fees. He gets full INR 40 like I had paid him in cash. I don't think any decentralized system w…
> What is so evil about a central bank? Don't know about India's central bank but US Fed plays with interest rates, bails out risk taking companies or their close friends creating moral hazard, prints money recklessly destroying your savings.
//US Fed plays with interest rates//
That's what central banks are for. That's how they control inflation or make the wheels of economy moving by printing more money. That's literally the reason for their existence, controlling money supply in an economy.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#208>family fraud (child and parent disagree with respect to desirability of purchasing the video game; bank backs parent; video game seller loses out),
'Fraud' is not a name for everything a seller doesn't like. This can happen without any bad intent, and the seller lost nothing. And frankly, if a video game seller didn't allow this type of refunding, they'd have much less of a market.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#209The article is factually incorrect when it talks about "SEPA payments", claiming they are a "pull" mechanism. What it probably meant to talk about, is SEPA Direct Debits -- where the counterpart charges your account, as opposed to you paying the counterpart. Given that these direct debit agreements are revokable at any point in time, I doubt the claims of very high fraud rate. A normal SEPA payment, is a "push" affai…
> Most banks charge a hefty fee for an instant payment (mine charges €1.25). Interesting. In my country (Finland) all banks that have joined the TIPS (SEPA Instant Settlement) always use it automatically if the destination bank supports it as well - at no extra charge to the account holder of course. Are you sure you are talking about TIPS / SCT Inst payments? Either way, your bank is not allowed to charge extra fees…
It depends on your bank. My Austrian bank charges a ridiculous fee of 8€ for an instant SEPA transfer.
Re: Bank transfers as a payment method
#210The article is factually incorrect when it talks about "SEPA payments", claiming they are a "pull" mechanism. What it probably meant to talk about, is SEPA Direct Debits -- where the counterpart charges your account, as opposed to you paying the counterpart. Given that these direct debit agreements are revokable at any point in time, I doubt the claims of very high fraud rate. A normal SEPA payment, is a "push" affai…
Not much of this applies to the UK. Faster Payments are almost ubiquitous here, and Authorized Push Payment fraud is a huge problem.
Faster Payments is the law in the UK, normal high street banks have to provide Faster Payments on ordinary current accounts. The banks actually shipped it without a working backend, I don't know if they completed it afterwards but initially it's just trust, Alice's bank tells Bob's bank she sent Bob £100 and Bob's bank do the database update and trust Alice's bank is good for the money later.
Push Payment fraud presumably subsided enormously after they changed the rules so it's interactive. Now you provide account number and name, the banks algorithmically decide if the name you provided is correct and if not tell the sender there is a problem. So push fraudsters need a fake account name and that's harder. Passing KYC checks for some random mule is do-able but good luck persuading the bank your name is Big Corp Electricity so that the push fraud works.