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Rust Moderation Team Resigns

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Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#691

Post by throwaway19937 »

tharne wrote: post #562
ferdowsi wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely, yes. A growing community needs healthy management in order to avoid reputational damage to the core language. There's no shortage of guidance to "stay away from X tech because the community is toxic and non-serious"

On average I've found projects with explicit CoC's to be more toxic than those projects without Coc's.

This could be Berkson's paradox (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkson%27s_paradox) in action. Larger projects probably have more toxicity than smaller projects and are more likely to have a CoC. The result is that the two factors appear to be correlated even if they are independent variables.

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#692

Post by throwaway2077 »

salmonellaeater wrote: post #688
throwaway2077 wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you've missed the shitshow about renaming GIMP a year or two ago. I tried looking for it now, but it seems the threads got purged

There's an article on The Register about it [1], which includes a helpful link to the archived threads [2]. A quote from the article: > "I have, on two occasions now, recommended this program to photography and graphic design educators (as an alternative to Photoshop) who told me that they considered it and found it good as software but weren't permitted by their institution to use it in the classroom because of the…

that's the one, thanks

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#693

Post by pc86 »

radlad wrote: post #536
pc86 wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean they certainly have a partisan stance re: prisons and incarceration. Not to say whether it's a good stance or not, but it's certainly partisan. Partisan doesn't mean "I disagree with this." But whatever it is and whatever your opinion of it, it's hard to make a cogent argument that it belongs as a banner on the front page of a programming language website.

> I mean they certainly have a partisan stance re: prisons and incarceration. I did not realize that providing counsel to inmates was a partisan issue. > But whatever it is and whatever your opinion of it, it's hard to make a cogent argument that it belongs as a banner on the front page of a programming language website. This is unrelated to my comment.

Unrelated to your comment maybe, but not the thread. It's certainly germane whether your choose to acknowledge it or not.

I'm clearly not referring to "providing counsel" and it takes only 10-15 seconds of reading their homepage to see policy positions that any reasonable person could consider partisan. But nice straw man. Let me know when you're interested in an actual discussion and not this nonsense.

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#694

Post by BoorishBears »

tialaramex wrote: post #521
BoorishBears wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, this line of thought is backwards. It stems from seeing the people issues as small stuff and the tech issues as the "real deal"... At the end of the day new features for popular language X are not that life-or-death (although I'm sure some Rust evangelist will claim the safety of it means it could save lives, ignoring things like MISRA) - If someone is being an asshole and damaging moral for real "meatspace" h…

> ignoring things like MISRA Not so much ignoring, as recognising that much of what MISRA requires mechanically (ie that MISRA tools will let you check for a Continuous Integration setup automatically) is baked into Rust itself, and much of what MISRA asks beyond that is built into Rust's way of doing things. My favourite this week: MISRA tells you never to use the result of an assignment operator. In Rust you can't…

MISRA goes further than Rust can and still be a widely useful language.

You'd need to define a very specific subset of Rust to approach its level of regulation and the additional layers added by ISO standards where it's often used

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#695

Post by GrayShade »

nabakin wrote: post #678
GrayShade wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did not extend her (interim) contract as Foundation chair. It's not "she didn't get a job", but rather "she didn't get the job she wanted".

So Steve was saying that Amazon is responsible for not letting Ashley remain interim chair? I don't remember him saying that either.

I'm not sure (nor do I care) by what mechanism, but yes: https://twitter.com/steveklabnik/status/1437441662998007809

I also seem to have confused the executive director and chair positions. She was the ED.

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#696

Post by rhn_mk1 »

thegrimmest wrote: post #549
rhn_mk1 wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is getting offended about someone insulting you or who starts discussions which make people angry unreasonable? I'm genuinely curious, maybe I misunderstand what it means to be offended.

Yes. People make themselves angry, people choose to take offense. The reasonable thing to do is not allow yourself to be provoked to upset or anger by someone else's communication. People you disagree with are easy to ignore, even if you find their opinions loathsome.

I can understand this reasoning when it comes to personal insults. I understand it less when it comes to tolerating baiting, which takes time and attention from the original reason (work, fun, etc.) of the social space. Why is being offended by not being able to communicate unreasonable?

I'm also interested in your take in the kind of communication that's intended to falsely undermine your reputation. I guess it's similar to the above example, but it's more personal and threatens group coherence. What's your take on being offended by that?

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#697

Post by throwaway2077 »

whimsicalism wrote: post #503
throwaway2077 wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>gender sex - sure, but gender? we got plenty of females in OSS!

More so in Rust than in many other communities was my perception. Far more trans women per capita in that community than Linux kernel dev. Still a general underrep of women. e: Oh I see - your comment wasn't in good faith at all.

>More so in Rust than in many other communities was my perception

not just yours :)

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#698

Post by unethical_ban »

ramchip wrote: post #555
swebs wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This person? https://archive.fo/f10KK

This website always return a "could not reach server" error for me (in Japan). Is there another source?

Cloudflare seems only to be giving the IPV6 address for archive.fo - try using quad9 or something else. Or hop on mobile.

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#699

Post by unethical_ban »

iamed2 wrote: post #84

There are two statements here regarding things that have happened: > the Core Team placing themselves unaccountable to anyone but themselves > we have been unable to enforce the Rust Code of Conduct to the standards the community expects of us and to the standards we hold ourselves to It's possible that there were CoC violations that they were not able to moderate, that the actions available to them were limited (e.g…

> I do think it's right for the mod team to not reveal the specifics in public; that would likely provoke targeted harassment and make the situation much worse

Instead, we have countless people bantering and taking "sides" about hypotheticals. In a world mostly devoid of secrets on the web, I think they could have, at the least, masked identities and summarized the issue.

Re: Rust Moderation Team Resigns

#700

Post by [deleted] »

zionic wrote: post #462
ferdowsi wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely, yes. A growing community needs healthy management in order to avoid reputational damage to the core language. There's no shortage of guidance to "stay away from X tech because the community is toxic and non-serious"

In my experience the people who, when asked about the technical merits of X, immediately dive into value judgements of a “community” around it are best ignored. If these types of people are in leadership positions, it’s too late and you need to move. If they’re below you, then you need to limit their reach and upward mobility. Usually fair application of performance standards will flush them out anyways. Often people…

[deleted]
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