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The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

nytimes.com

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Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#191

Post by cuddlybacon »

kevincrane wrote: post #18
paulgb wrote: post #4

The thing that excites me most about e-bikes is that they change the politics around cycling. Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. With e-bikes becoming more common, I know a number of people who would not have touched a bike share but are using it as a replacement for Uber/Lyft rides. People…

> Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. Which I think is misguided pushback btw (which I think you agree with based on the context). I see it as a chicken and egg thing. The roads are unsafe for bikers, so the only people who bike are those who are super dedicated to it. Then when people ask fo…

> Safer roads means more people will bike, which means biking will stop being seen as an elitist thing.

I don't think it is just safety. Most people understand an e-bike is going to be more dangerous, but they are popular anyways.

The other factor is distance. e-bikes increase the distance that can be covered by a significant amount, which changes a lot of commutes from "too far" to acceptable. The only people who can afford to be within a bike commute are at least above-average income-wise.

Even satire news sites have caught onto this: https://www.thebeaverton.com/2020/09/i-bike-everywhere-brags...

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#192

Post by wanderingstan »

mrep wrote: post #171
notatoad wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

again, this is exactly the sort of politics that hopefully will change as more people ride bikes. yes, there's some bad cyclists. but because there's few enough cyclists, people who aren't cyclists like to group us all together. when a driver or pedestrian is an asshole, you say the person was an asshole, because you understand that they don't represent all drivers or all pedestrians any more than you do. but when a…

In my experience, the percentage of cyclists that disregard the rules of the road are an order of magnitude higher than car drivers.

When people mention this, I always ask what percentage of cars are following the speed limit—a rule of the road all the more important when piloting a vehicle which can easily kill. Cyclists disregarding the rules of the road are lower percentage, and primarily endanger themselves.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#193

Post by clairity »

dan-robertson wrote: post #113
clairity wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i'd personally like to see two policy changes (especially in a city like LA that's perfect year-round for biking): 1. convert curbside parking into dedicated and protected bike lanes (not everywhere, but extensively) 2. require bike parking (preferably covered and right next to entrances/foot traffic) and liability requirements anywhere that has a (car) parking lot this would put biking on par with cars and would enc…

Isn’t LA extremely sparse to the extent that cycling is a lot of effort because of long distances? I suppose e-bikes help but don’t you still lose a lot of the advantages—less time at the start and end of journeys and less distance from parking areas—to the increased travel time from large distances?

not really, though socal on the whole is a sprawl. greater LA is decentralized into a bunch of blended edge cities[0], but the city itself is basically split into the LA basin and the san fernando valley. within these sub-regions, it's eminently bikable, with the two areas linked by subway and rail for bikers. central LA, encompassing downtown through mid-wilshire and toward santa monica/venice, is relatively dense (20-40k/sq mi), and roughly 15 miles from downtown to the beach (also connected by light rail). if you live in this central LA area (or central san fernando), most places you need to go are less than an hour's e-bike ride away, and most likely less than 1/2 hour away.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edge_cities

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#194

Post by 8note »

UnFleshedOne wrote: post #132
cameldrv wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a real problem. IMO, the issue really is that ebikes are too good/too flexible. They are fast enough to get you to work quickly and more comfortably mix with city traffic. The flipside is that they're too fast to mix with pedestrian traffic. If there were some way of limiting speed on mixed use paths, e-bikes would be perfect.

Speed limits is how it is usually done -- cars can all go much faster than most roads allow for and we are mostly fine. Set speed limits and mercilessly fine serious violations, and the problem goes away as far as it will ever be.

If you design the road to feel unsafe at high speed, travellers will automatically slow down

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#195

Post by [deleted] »

TrevorJ wrote: post #86
paulgb wrote: post #4

The thing that excites me most about e-bikes is that they change the politics around cycling. Proponents of efforts to make roads safer for cyclists have always gotten pushback from people who think that cycling is a niche hobby of rich lycra-clad yuppies. With e-bikes becoming more common, I know a number of people who would not have touched a bike share but are using it as a replacement for Uber/Lyft rides. People…

It cuts both ways. I am lucky enough to live in an area with an EXTENSIVE system of mixed-use trails for bikes and pedestrians. I worry that e-bikes, which are potentially much less pedestrian-friendly, will lead to a pushback against bikes being used on these trials at all.

[deleted]

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#196

Post by kibwen »

TrevorJ wrote: post #93
jacquesm wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those speed limiters are indeed stupid, especially because on a 'regular' bike you can fairly easily outrun a normal e-bike (though probably not for as long unless you are in very good shape). Normal ones should be limited at 35 or so and speed-pedelecs at 50 Kph so you don't end up holding up other traffic. Where I live a speed-pedelec has to be in traffic but it isn't allowed to go as fast as that traffic, which cr…

I'm of the mind that it's up to every individual to decide how much risk they want to take, but I think an e-bike that can do 55 mph is significantly more dangerous than a motorcycle. Tiny amount of traction, no ability to maneuver or speed up further to get yourself out of a dangerous position. Crude/no suspension. No traction control, no turn signals, silent. Cars on the road see a pedal bike and expect you to beha…

People appear to be mixing units here, I believe the parent commenter was using kph, not mph.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#197

Post by jackorange »

chrisseaton wrote: post #190
jackorange wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue goes further than that into being a societal problem. Majority of America is overweight, staring down at their phones day and night, and dread physical activity. They also like to flex their position and wealth to others, one of the reasons why pickup trucks and big SUVs sell in great numbers. These people are in no hurry to transition to riding bikes. The only way biking might work is if some popul…

Popular celebrities on social media already work out - why do you think Americans aren't already imitating it and why would they imitate bicycling?

They do imitate it, they do enough to take pictures of themselves and they buy into the sports clothing brands and entertainment. Few actually do regular and consistent exercise.

I think there would be an increase in biking if the celebs did it, but I say this imagining a new generation of Americana growing up watching a bunch of them doing it, not just one or two starting tomorrow and the nation follows suit.

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#198

Post by hodgesrm »

analog31 wrote: post #137
Spooky23 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a point, but the Lance Armstrong wannabes make everyone miserable. In my area, they “took over” a popular bike trail and now kids and more casual people are pushed aside. It’s like dealing with serious lap swimmers.

Time for a Critical Mass of casual cyclists. ;-)

I think you meant a Casual Mass of critical cyclists. :)

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#199

Post by jnwatson »

enriquto wrote: post #94
TrevorJ wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It cuts both ways. I am lucky enough to live in an area with an EXTENSIVE system of mixed-use trails for bikes and pedestrians. I worry that e-bikes, which are potentially much less pedestrian-friendly, will lead to a pushback against bikes being used on these trials at all.

Mixed-use paths are an extremely bad idea and dangerous for everybody. I actively avoid them as a pedestrian and as a cyclist. They should all disappear. If ebikes help to accelerate the inevitable dismissal of these stupid mixed-use lanes, so good! A bike-friendly infrastructure is based on three separate networks, for pedestrians, cycles and cars. Each of the three networks must be continuous, reasonably complete a…

We’re starting to separate popular mixed-use paths in Northern VA:

https://www.insidenova.com/news/arlington/w-od-trail-effort-...

Re: The popularity of e-bikes isn’t slowing down

#200

Post by SahAssar »

Robotbeat wrote: post #50
packetlost wrote: post #5

I've long been of the opinion that the real winner in the EV market will be personal vehicles (such as eBikes) and electric mass transit, not larger EVs such as cars in most urban environments.

That’s unlikely. From a revenue standpoint, ebikes are cheap and you don’t need that many e-buses. Even if we go to Netherlands-level bike-friendliness, that’s only a 40% reduction in per capita car/truck ownership at best. Doesn’t mean we won’t do a lot of miles by bike or bus, but as long as people have the money for it, they’ll still buy at least one car per household for cornercases that buses and bikes (& ride s…

> that’s only a 40% reduction in per capita car/truck ownership at best.

What is that based on?

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