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Telegram Ad Platform

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Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#211

Post by IceWreck »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #160
IceWreck wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The open source fdroid builds don't do that, instead they receive notifications another way, without google's push service.

Can you please elaborate, what 'another way'? I know only one: keeping the app running as a service, with all associated drawbacks. The app we develop (an XMPP client) does just that. On iOS, it is not possible at all. To make an app receive messages and notify user about them, you must use APNS, and to do that you have to upload your keys to Telegram.

Yes, the app runs in the background. It kills the battery, but you have to compromise on that if you do not want to have google services on your phone.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#212

Post by dymk »

jeroenhd wrote: post #163
dymk wrote: post #2

I’m very curious to see if this is a success for the platform! It looks like a very not-creepy way to serve up ads. One thing concerns me though (if I were to ever end up wanting to advertise) - no external links! Giving the audience to the thing I’m advertising is most of the reason I’d spend money on an ad. I wonder what sorts of ads are useful if they’re text-only? They qualify no “external” links, so maybe you co…

> It looks like a very not-creepy way to serve up ads. Context-based advertising is great for web content (and should have been made the standard years ago), but in a chat room, I'm not so sure. How does Telegram pick the relevant "topic"? From the channel description alone? I don't think that would be accurate at all. They do it for now, but who knows what will happen in a year or two! Their profit margin is on the…

I’m not sure, but perhaps because they’re only serving these up in large channels, manual tagging will be used. Channel operators might be doing this work, with the revenue sharing agreement.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#213

Post by eduhecateaway »

bo0tzz wrote: post #204
TacticalCoder wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I get it’s not end to end encrypted but that’s not what I am asking for with telegram - just a decent messaging app that makes it easy to remain anonymous (not sharing phone number)... Big thumbs here to TG: I don't use WhatsApp. Never installed it, never will. TG is not just about "not being FB": the UI is really cool and the synch between several devices (say phone and laptop) is flawless. Now... You wrote "easy…

AFAIK you do have to use a phone number to sign up with Telegram, but you never need to expose it to other users. I assume that's the kind of anonymity that OP means.

That doesn't hide your identity from a government that wants to arrest you for unapproved speech.

If you're an LGBTQ user in many countries, you might want more anonymity than a "please don't show this to other users" button.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#214

Post by the_gipsy »

lxgr wrote: post #179
the_gipsy wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has some convenience tradeoffs. E.g. I can read the same chat on phone and desktop without hiccups.

WhatsApp does that too now, even on the web. Signal has a desktop client as well (no web one, unfortunately) – I also haven't seen any hiccups there. Yes, this is 10 or 100 times more complicated to get right when using end-to-end encryption, but it's clearly doable, and Telegram has finally been proven wrong empirically about there being a dilemma of security vs. usability in messaging. Yes, they still lead the fiel…

> WhatsApp does that too now, even on the web.

It just doesn’t work right. It’s good for typing with a keyboard, but other than that, it’s always lagging behind the phone, which has to be online.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#215

Post by throwaway473825 »

dotancohen wrote: post #201
tallanvor wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you expect them to care about your preferences, but you don't care about theirs? That seems pretty selfish.

I am not installing an application which collects my data and spoonfeds it to entities with the explicit intention of influencing my behavior. No matter what side benefit that app provides. And yes, I prefer to not communicate with people who would make such demands of me.

Isn't that precisely what Telegram does? Unlike Facebook, they actually have all your data.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#216

Post by dotancohen »

throwaway473825 wrote: post #215
dotancohen wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not installing an application which collects my data and spoonfeds it to entities with the explicit intention of influencing my behavior. No matter what side benefit that app provides. And yes, I prefer to not communicate with people who would make such demands of me.

Isn't that precisely what Telegram does? Unlike Facebook, they actually have all your data.

I trust Telegram with my data like I trust my wife with my credit card. So far Telegram, like the wife, has been responsible.

I trust Whatsapp with my data like I trust 409 internet princes with my credit card. Their reputation precedes them.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#217

Post by lxgr »

dotancohen wrote: post #198
lxgr wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It definitely is a Shibboleth: Everybody recommending it to me so far has done so either due to usability (which I get) or "because it's encrypted and more secure than WhatsApp". The latter is a very good indicator of misplaced faith in shoddy news outlets propagating these claims uneditorialized.

> "because it's encrypted and more secure than WhatsApp". Sure, you'll find people believing and spreading misleading statements everywhere. Encrypted, compared to Whatsapp, is wrong. But secure? Sure. I much prefer governments getting access to my data via snooping than advertising companies being spoon fed my data with the intention of influencing my opinion.

Telegram does get access to your data, and them getting into advertisement is literally the topic of this discussion.

As a result, governments aren't getting access to Telegram, advertisers are.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#218

Post by lxgr »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #209
lxgr wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fact that nobody really wants a true p2p platform: you don't want to lose all your stuff if you lose the device. Why not provide encrypted backups to a personal cloud storage service? Even WhatsApp does it these days.

I don't mind you doing it and showing us how it should be done. Ah, btw, how will a true p2p platform work on iOS? What entity will send you push notifications when there are messages for your device?

End-to-end encrypted backups? Like this, for example (I personally don't trust the HSMs/password scheme, but it's optional): https://engineering.fb.com/2021/09/10/security/whatsapp-e2ee...

True P2P on iOS: No idea, I merely claimed that a lack of backup options is not the reason we don't have it.

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#219

Post by tryauuum »

whyoh wrote: post #115
dotancohen wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Any Telegram users here? Telegram vs Whatsapp use today is sort of a Shibboleth. Those who only use Whatsapp are typically lax about privacy and security, whereas Telegram users typically take these thing seriously. So those who target the vulnerable are definitely focusing on Whatsapp right now. The self-selection is working very well in Telegram's favour, though that probably is just a happy side effect.

>whereas Telegram users typically take these thing seriously. And yet they don't mind the lack of encryption?

I understand and respect your motive for saying that telegram has no encryption. At the same time I cannot stop hating you for improper use of words.

I wish there was a simple and catchy word for describing a "vulnerable to the government" encryption

Re: Telegram Ad Platform

#220

Post by lxgr »

the_gipsy wrote: post #214
lxgr wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WhatsApp does that too now, even on the web. Signal has a desktop client as well (no web one, unfortunately) – I also haven't seen any hiccups there. Yes, this is 10 or 100 times more complicated to get right when using end-to-end encryption, but it's clearly doable, and Telegram has finally been proven wrong empirically about there being a dilemma of security vs. usability in messaging. Yes, they still lead the fiel…

> WhatsApp does that too now, even on the web. It just doesn’t work right. It’s good for typing with a keyboard, but other than that, it’s always lagging behind the phone, which has to be online.

Not anymore!

https://faq.whatsapp.com/general/download-and-installation/a...

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