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Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

brown.edu

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Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#151

Post by boublepop »

qxfys wrote: post #149
tombert wrote: post #3

This is really cool. I'm 30 right now, and only just recently finished my bachelors and have been looking to get a PhD, but it's really hard to find a program that will let you work full time while doing it. It doesn't help that a part of me does sort of feel "too old" to do this sometimes. The PhD system in the US is really tailored around the assumption that you haven't entered the corporate world yet. Anyway, it's…

A fellow PhD student here. Come to Sweden (or, rather, Nordic countries in general). There are a lot of opportunities as an industrial PhD student. There are at least 3 out of 10 PhD students in my group doing research while still working in the industry. Usually, the deal is 80% PhD and 20% industry, but I know someone doing 50:50.

You don’t even need an industrial PhD. In Denmark at least, a PhD study is a paid position, essentially just a job that runs 3 years and results in handing in a PhD dissertation. It pays less than what you get in the industry, but very decently, so no need to balance multiple jobs, just focus on your research.

The Industrial PhD pays the same here, so that’s mostly a position you would take if you specifically want to collaborate with a company on some research project, not something you do because of income considerations.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#153

Post by laichzeit0 »

grayclhn wrote: post #135
laichzeit0 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let’s assume this is a CS PhD (so no “lab” work). Is this person doing 60 hours of actual research a week? If I did a PhD while working full time, I would expect to do purely research. I’m not interested in teaching or grading papers or anything non-dissertation related. Btw, this is how most people do their PhDs here. It’s a quick in and out 3 year seal-team like operation. Caveat: We see Ph.D as a degree you do aft…

When I was in grad school (Econ, not CS) teaching, etc., was less than 10h a week. The rest of the time was research. So yeah, 60+ hours of actual research a week.

That seems... excessive? 60 hours a week / 5 days a week is 12 hours a day. Even working Saturdays, that would give you 10 hours a day 6 days a week. I personally have never met any single PhD student who did that amount of pure research each week for 5 or 6 years. Again, I'm not talking about "lab" type research.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#154

Post by happy-go-lucky »

" ... I wanted to do something that keeps my mind active. But it is a matter of whatever you want to do. If you have a dream, follow it. Sometimes that dream may never have been verbalized, it may be buried in the subconscious. It is important not to waste your older days. There is a lot of brainpower in older people and I think it can be of enormous benefit to younger generations. Older people have experience and many times history repeats itself.”

I see this as a way to protect one's health and sanity as one ages. Aging gracefully should be possible.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#155

Post by JustFinishedBSG »

skeeter2020 wrote: post #86
baby wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try France, it’s very common to do a PhD inside of a company.

As stated above European PhD are not typically the same as North American PhDs. I've never seen a respected program here that allows for part-time let alone while holding down a full-time job.

Industrial PhDs are NOT part-time. They are full time, except instead of having to teach to get money you trade it for small industrial tasks.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#156

Post by JustFinishedBSG »

sytelus wrote: post #128
arpa wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PhD is still a PhD in any continent. How academics organize their work is another question.

It is actually not. Many 3 year PhD or part time ones are not recognized for immigration or jobs in USA.

1. PhD in the USAs are 3 years too if you count like europeans do (we don't include the masters) 2. Industrial PhDs are not part time PhDs, it's a different thing.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#157

Post by CalRobert »

azhenley wrote: post #5
tombert wrote: post #3

This is really cool. I'm 30 right now, and only just recently finished my bachelors and have been looking to get a PhD, but it's really hard to find a program that will let you work full time while doing it. It doesn't help that a part of me does sort of feel "too old" to do this sometimes. The PhD system in the US is really tailored around the assumption that you haven't entered the corporate world yet. Anyway, it's…

Professor here. You definitely aren’t too old, but I would never take on a PhD student that wants to continue working elsewhere. A PhD is a full-time job. It took me 6.5 years and was hard enough with very little outside distractions.

Why should someone give up several years of income for a PhD?

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#158

Post by qxfys »

boublepop wrote: post #151
qxfys wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A fellow PhD student here. Come to Sweden (or, rather, Nordic countries in general). There are a lot of opportunities as an industrial PhD student. There are at least 3 out of 10 PhD students in my group doing research while still working in the industry. Usually, the deal is 80% PhD and 20% industry, but I know someone doing 50:50.

You don’t even need an industrial PhD. In Denmark at least, a PhD study is a paid position, essentially just a job that runs 3 years and results in handing in a PhD dissertation. It pays less than what you get in the industry, but very decently, so no need to balance multiple jobs, just focus on your research. The Industrial PhD pays the same here, so that’s mostly a position you would take if you specifically want t…

Yup, that's correct.

Maybe it depends on the field and the country, but I know some industrial PhD position pays a better salary than the one employed full time by the university. Not sure if it is considered to be "much", but at least around 20% more.

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#159

Post by patrec »

Can anyone with a background in the area comment on how legit this is?

I have no trouble believing that a spry research professor in a quantitative field could get a PhD in another quantitative field at a fairly advanced age, especially if they can bring existing skills that are underused in their new domain, but it would be genuinely amazing if someone in his 80ies were to successfully

> set to work on a very difficult problem [...] the theory that he was doing involves techniques that are incredibly advanced and challenging to master

in physics, a field were people are often considered over the hill past their 20ies, and an elite uni at that. The only reference to his work a quick google scholar search turned up is from 2012:

https://meetings.aps.org/Meeting/MAR12/Session/Z26.1

Re: Physics Student Earns PhD at Age 89

#160

Post by blip54321 »

ildon wrote: post #148
tombert wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You definitely aren’t too old By "old" I didn't mean actual biological age exactly. I guess the more appropriate word would be something more like "settled". As it stands, I have a mortgage and whatnot to take care of, it's not really realistic for me to quit my job and focus full-time on a PhD for the next 5-6 years. > but I would never take on a PhD student that wants to continue working elsewhere That seems to b…

EU Professor here. You're right, expectations are very different in the "old continent". Things very quite significantly from country to country, but generally speaking in most EU you can do your PhD while working. Retrospectively, knowing what I know know, I should add that if I were to start a PhD now I wouldn't trust a university that asks for a full time commitment, no exceptions. I would be very suspicious that…

New continent:

- Full time commitment seems critical to the process. A Ph.D is a time of intellectual exploration, and you can't really do that fighting work and family deadlines.

- On the other hand, time can be squished for older people by virtue of industry experience making them more efficient

- I'd be hesitant about remote, since so much of a Ph.D is learning from others. Hallway conversations are critical. That's possible remotely, but not common.

- Fully agreed about "side activities." Teaching is fine -- you learn A LOT from it -- but a lot of Ph.D programs give stupid administrative grunt work. The metaphorical cleaning of test tubes on a professor's project is a serious red flag.

No such thing as too old, but having a mortgage and family myself now, I definitely get much out of a Ph.D program right now.

I'll mention too: If I didn't have a Ph.D, I'm mature and disciplined enough now that I could learn the same without a formal program.

I am skeptical of new world "accelerated" programs, which often have little substance, and are designed to milk working professionals. It's like getting the piece of paper in Wizard of Oz.

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