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The metaverse is bullshit

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Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#481

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why the heck am I driving a car around? I can fly, can't I? By this logic nobody should play Gran Turismo because a Superman game exists. > You can't test legroom or the seat cushions, because your avatar doesn't don't have a body. So I don't see how you can realistically sell an actual real-world car, because isn't most of its function and design unnecessary in the metaverse? By this logic it's pointless to make a…

The point the OP is making is VR isn’t a domain where you test drive practical family cars. Sure you have racing games but how many people can afford, let alone justify, high ended performance cars for their family? And how many racing games do you see where people are driving boring (relatively speaking) family cars? The point about VR games are that they’re an unrealistic escape. If you wanted a 1:1 with actual rea…

>If you wanted a 1:1 with actual reality then you wouldn’t need Virtual Reality in the first place.

What? Why?

A 1:1 with reality that is cheap and convenient enough to be an equivalent to modern smartphones would be an honest to god revolution.

Imagine face-to-face social media where a group of 20 strangers from all over the world and across 13 different socio-culutral groups are sitting down drinking virtual beer (which is actually just your perspective if you prefer beer, the orange-juice-loving person in the group is seeing the whole group drinking orange juice) and discussing the latest celebrity scandal. All of the cosmopolitanism and variety of social media, none of its artficiality and bullshit.

(Off course there is going to be new bullshit in this world, people will go through various hoops to pull idiotic pranks on other people and scammers will have a terrifying field day with the new convincing techniques the new medium will bring, but at this point this is just more or less real life. Real Life In Your Pocket that is. (hopefully eventually, it will have a PC phase first). Who is not excited by that?)

Imagine a professional like an airline pilot or a heart surgeon transmitting a read-only record of a flight or an operation, complete with haptic feedback and a temperature-and-wind reconstruction of the transmission environment. Imagine those records dumped to storage and serving as humanity's Library Of Crafts, a correction to our ancient shortcoming of only being able to capture in symbols what could be said (and with photography and microphones, what could be seen or heard), but not what could be felt or experienced.

Won't this absolutely revolutionise learning and communication? There is a very clear path from here to eventual Greg-Egan-style post-singular communication where you are roaming freely in abstract structures residing everywhere from your head to a server in orbit.

Every thought or system or structure ever dreamt up by the human mind began with a 1:1 snapshot of reality that was then further filtered and compressed (Hume's golden mountain). The ability to arbitrarily construct, store, transmit and reconstruct 1:1 ever-more-convincing sensory representations of the world at will is nothing short of a revolution comparable to the invention of language.

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#482
post #472
post #416

I think that a lot of the cynicism about this space comes from theorisers who have not yet tried VR for themselves and experienced viscerally + emotionally for themselves, the fact that it is a total game-changer for work and play. The thing with this space is, enough smart people are sufficiently excited by this new media and working on realising its potential, that it will inevitably end up producing value that can…

I will use VR when I can put on my headset, anywhere, and be transported to my "desk". I want to be able to take documents and move them around in VR, read them, put them on my "table", and then have apps that appear as monitors. So I can move and pull up email in front of me, "grab" an attachment, and "put" it into another email that I will compose. And have emails look like a stack of papers that you could actually…

Lastly! You only need 1 device. So spending $5k+ on a device that could provide a better experience than your TV, iPad, laptop, desktop, monitors, headphones, and everything else would be reasonable.

The way we interact with tech today is a semi-distracted state. There is always some sort of "real world" going on, and we're not immersed. It would take more energy to be fully immersed, but we would be more productive from it. It could make using "old" tech very boring and not worth the time when you could do a much better job, or have a better experience through VR.

And people say "well people watch TV or movies together". Sure, maybe. You're in the same room, but you could both throw on headsets, enter the same virtual room, and "watch" together, whether you are in the same room or not. And it might highlight that there are higher quality forms of recreation than sitting and watching TV together.

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If if the buyer can afford the car they can just to go a dealership and test drive one, and get a 1:1 experience. This is about advertising and trying to sell advertising as experience rather than advertising. What else would you imagine facebook's virtual space to be?

Like an enhanced version of Second Life. If you don't offer some kind of immersive experience then no one will bother participating. Advertising as experience is exactly what I'm describing by having a car that behaves like the real one. Otherwise it's a dumb model with no difference from any other car/ad there.

You can't have a car that behaves like the real one in vr...especially not in oculus quest like set ups. Its just bullshit for advertisers.

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#484

"Why don't the tech billionaires chasing after sci-fi metaverses get that these fictional virtual realities seem great on the page but would be hell to actually live in 12 hours a day? I truly do not know, but I think it may have something to do with their refusal to admit that they are the baddies." They are the baddies. Let's not forget WEF's aims that we "will own nothing and be happy" by 2030. My impression is th…

This is to say, that the baddie's intent is not to sell us on this vision.

Rather they are attempting to provide us with a consolation prize that we accept as if we wanted it. Because they plan to make real reality so unbearable we will want an escape!

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#485
post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook did have a budding developer ecosystem back in late 2000s with game developers and app developers using Facebook's platform to build their businesses. While it did have tons of privacy issues and data leaks, they could have built it into a sustainable ecosystem instead of making endless changes forcing developers to leave their ecosystem.

Aw - I remember Cow Clicker. I wonder what happened to all that stuff.

They changed the game spamming algorithms from insane to useless. It was many orders of magnitude less traffic so I’d imagine most of those games are in life support or shut down

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#486
post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s super weird. I’d look for a new job real quick if I was required to do stand up with be goggles in. WTF is wrong with people… Rapport is built through authenticity and vulnerability, not fucking avatars.

Nobody is forcing us to use this tech. If we all happened to agree that it was annoying or "super weird" then we would just opt out. Fact is, that for now it feels valuable enough for us to keep using it (more so for social 'hangouts' than for things like stand-ups, which we still do via Zoom and where we can be as authentic and vulnerable as we like)

How many people participate? Doesn’t seem like it would scale outside a small group. Once you get past that size, it becomes a clique and thus corrosive to team building. A small group will have a wonderful time, everyone else will resent them. The company will then crumble or become something different entirely

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#487
post #171

This thread feels like 1860's consilium on what future will look like 500 years later. The shape of the metaverse will be formed by a new generation, not by older guys (and not by fortnite addicts who play by the rules of the former) who know nothing better than drive a fancy “car” on the “road”, as if roads or a concept of physical movement or the euclidean rule would still be there for common use and not for museum…

Without the "concept of physical movement" how will "food" get to your "house"?

'Food' will be piped directly into your veins, via the food pipe in your 'home cubicle'. Lol :)

And will then exit, captured and recycled!

Welcome to the future!

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#488
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’re you talking about? You can make a low end VR headset out of a $100 smartphone and a $5 plastic box today 5-10 years after VR starts to really take off, you’ll be able to get a decent standalone VR headset for $200 or less. They’ll probably be cheaper to make than laptops or TVs in the long run because of the smaller displays.

> You can make a low end VR headset out of a $100 smartphone and a $5 plastic box today That's not low end VR, it's pain and frustration from knowing you just wasted 105 bucks. It sounds to me like you never tried a setup like this. Because in reality you mainly spend time adjusting the lenses because focus is so bad you can't even tell which setting is better. The pixel grid is so huge that reading any form of text…

haha, easy there killer. I hate Google Cardboard for poisoning the well just as much as everyone in this subthread does

Someone was going on and on about how Facebook is showing off a (likely) $50,000 prototype and I was just explaining that 2021's $50,000 prototype is 2031's $100 at Wal-Mart

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#489
The most disturbing and dystopian announcement humanity ever witnessed.

While the eastern wisdom suggests that we sit down, clear our heads, and connect with our bodies, here we are at the opposite extreme where your senses are completely immersed in an environment managed by a company that did everything to maximize profit and increase addiction.

Human body exists in the physical world, not in a second life. They need to thrive in that world not into some "metaverse". People already glued to their phones, next, they are completely helpless, connected to a headset in a fantasy world, dysfunctional in the real one. Beside what exactly is this adding to people's life? internet is already connecting people thoughts and ideas, perhaps the effort they put to see each other in real life is worth it.

No thank you. And that is not a vision I would like to pass for the coming generation either.

Re: The metaverse is bullshit

#490
post #416

I think that a lot of the cynicism about this space comes from theorisers who have not yet tried VR for themselves and experienced viscerally + emotionally for themselves, the fact that it is a total game-changer for work and play. The thing with this space is, enough smart people are sufficiently excited by this new media and working on realising its potential, that it will inevitably end up producing value that can…

> enough smart people are sufficiently excited by this new media > Large swathes of smart people who see unrealised possibilities You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Jeremy, that you?
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