The Amish have negotiated a pact with modernity (2018) • Hacker News Board

Re: The Amish have negotiated a pact with modernity (2018)

#141

Post by zepto » Sat, Oct 30, 2021, 1:31 AM UTC

terr-dav wrote: post #140

zepto wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tendency exists for sure, but there is nothing supporting the claim that it’s impossible . The Amish themselves are an example. Also there are other eco villages and communities that have managed.

It seems like they have chosen to abstain from capitalism and have been allowed to exist because they don’t represent a threat to the capitalist order. Also, by definition, if collective choices are being made about the use of technology, then it’s not capitalism.

You have a bizarre and manifestly incorrect view of capitalism.

Collective choices get made within capitalism all the time. Corporations, clubs, cooperatives, unions, associations, etc, cities, counties, countries, etc, are all legally established collective choice making groups. There is also nothing preventing people from forming their own groups by free association.

Re: The Amish have negotiated a pact with modernity (2018)

#142

Post by LargoLasskhyfv » Sat, Oct 30, 2021, 3:04 PM UTC

klipt wrote: post #92

burnafter184 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm no historian, so this is a very rough synthesis: In history there's a handful of cases where there have been what are viewed as probably warless societies. Honestly I wouldn't say they fared any worse than warring states. Indus Valley Civilization, Rapa Nui Civilization, Early Sumeria... I'm sure there's countless others in reality but those are what I recall off the top of my head. I find it difficult to actuall…

Since this is Hacker News, I think a simple tech analogy is that you can do about as well without any national security as you can do without any cyber security. If you don't believe in threats, why use https?

Because otherwise paranoid browsers warn about possible warp core meltdown.

Re: The Amish have negotiated a pact with modernity (2018)

#143

Post by terr-dav » Wed, Nov 10, 2021, 9:22 PM UTC

zepto wrote: post #141

terr-dav wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like they have chosen to abstain from capitalism and have been allowed to exist because they don’t represent a threat to the capitalist order. Also, by definition, if collective choices are being made about the use of technology, then it’s not capitalism.

You have a bizarre and manifestly incorrect view of capitalism. Collective choices get made within capitalism all the time. Corporations, clubs, cooperatives, unions, associations, etc, cities, counties, countries, etc, are all legally established collective choice making groups. There is also nothing preventing people from forming their own groups by free association.

ahem Cooperatives and unions are by definition not capitalist.

The key feature of a capitalist enterprise is that the workers and the owners are not the same group. This is in contrast with a socialist enterprise, where the owners and the workers are the same group.

There is a ton of stuff preventing people from forming their own groups. Have you seen how companies (see Amazon & Starbucks recently) react to people attempting to do so?