At my local college the guy the physic department building was named after was obsessed with some weird thing that no one understood and when he died they just mothballed all his "projects" equipment. No one had any idea what it was or what to do with it and it filled a good part of the building. He was not easy to get along with and shot down anything that he didn't like without even discussion. I'm told this is not in any way uncommon in the field.
Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
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Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#22No, it isn't waning. There are struggles, but that doesn't mean its waning. We're having massive progress in medicine, space, cosmology, environment, biology, food, transportation. Hell, the only thing that's waning is public perception of science and that seems to be a deliberate political attack.
I think it's obviously waning if you look at any field that deals with physical world: a car from 1940 looks totally different than one from 1980's, but the one from 2020 and 1980 looks almost the same. Space rockets are same as they were in 80's, where are nuclear engines, fusion propultion, etc? Its the same for airplanes, appliances, and everything execept computers. https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/145134227466…
Cars are still vastly different today than in the 80s in (at least) performance, efficiency, and safety.
Planes are also getting quite a bit better, although adoption of these planes is slow as most airlines want to get as much as they can out of the old fleet.[0]
SpaceX has been landing their rockets for several years now, and are about to take an even bigger step with Starship.
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#23No, it isn't waning. There are struggles, but that doesn't mean its waning. We're having massive progress in medicine, space, cosmology, environment, biology, food, transportation. Hell, the only thing that's waning is public perception of science and that seems to be a deliberate political attack.
I think it's obviously waning if you look at any field that deals with physical world: a car from 1940 looks totally different than one from 1980's, but the one from 2020 and 1980 looks almost the same. Space rockets are same as they were in 80's, where are nuclear engines, fusion propultion, etc? Its the same for airplanes, appliances, and everything execept computers. https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/145134227466…
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#24No, it isn't waning. There are struggles, but that doesn't mean its waning. We're having massive progress in medicine, space, cosmology, environment, biology, food, transportation. Hell, the only thing that's waning is public perception of science and that seems to be a deliberate political attack.
I think it's obviously waning if you look at any field that deals with physical world: a car from 1940 looks totally different than one from 1980's, but the one from 2020 and 1980 looks almost the same. Space rockets are same as they were in 80's, where are nuclear engines, fusion propultion, etc? Its the same for airplanes, appliances, and everything execept computers. https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/145134227466…
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#25Newton's great accomplishment was discovering a link between terrestrial and extraterrestrial physics.
Today on the large scale we see it takes multiple kinds of "dark matter" to explain the rotation of galaxies, structure of galaxy clusters, and cosmology. "Dark matter" evades any attempt to detect it on Earth.
Einstein's prediction of how light was bent in gravitational fields was tested by Sir Arthur Eddington in a few years. Last year observational evidence was found for a circa-1980 theory of black hole jets. Neutrino Oscillations were detected in 1998 and have been one of the few areas where particle accelerators get non-null results; the theory for that was developed in 1957 by an Italian physicist who defected to the Soviet Union. (No Nobel Prize!)
Since the gap between theory and confirmation of the theory could span a whole career, young physicists need to survive by pleasing their elders with fashionable theories for a decade without any feedback from the physical universe.
A strange counterexample was the 1980 rise of inflationary cosmology, where the problem and solution were discovered together. (Somehow nobody was bothered by the "Horizon Problem" until then.) It was Alan Guth's answer to survival in the physics hiring drought of his time.
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#26No, it isn't waning. There are struggles, but that doesn't mean its waning. We're having massive progress in medicine, space, cosmology, environment, biology, food, transportation. Hell, the only thing that's waning is public perception of science and that seems to be a deliberate political attack.
I think it's obviously waning if you look at any field that deals with physical world: a car from 1940 looks totally different than one from 1980's, but the one from 2020 and 1980 looks almost the same. Space rockets are same as they were in 80's, where are nuclear engines, fusion propultion, etc? Its the same for airplanes, appliances, and everything execept computers. https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/145134227466…
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#27Progress in fields like physics is definitely more incremental though as compared to e.g. the first half of the last century when the foundations of modern physics were laid (quantum mechanis, special and general relativity, quantum field theory, ...). Then again, there are many "small" cracks that start showing up in various theories (dark matter & dark energy being one), so I hope we'll soon discover something as groundbreaking as general relativity or quantum mechanics that explains some of them and makes the universe even more interesting.
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#28Papers in established fields naturally have narrower and more specific, i.e., smaller impact over time because most papers are fine-tuning things, asking smaller questions, and not building brand new theories or frameworks from the ground up. It’s expected that Newtonian physics is not going to be re-invented every year, right? Newton did it, and now the questions left are how gravity works at scales and speeds we can’t observe everyday on earth. Nobody will ever supplant Newton, because he was first.
I’ve watched this happen in my own field, computer graphics. The early papers that have lasting impact are the ones that were inventing the field and laying the frameworks for how to think about it. The rendering equation, the shadow map and Phong shading are ideas that wouldn’t get published today, however they were pioneering at the time. Now the questions we have are about things like what is the true microfiber surface shape of human hair strands, so that we can increase realism by 1% compared to the previous hair models.
If you compare them side by side in the context of today, increasing realism of hair shading is a more difficult question to answer than the earlier question of how to interpolate a shading normal across a triangle.
So, yes scientific progress is waning in the sense that we’re inventing fewer fields and fewer new theories. There are fewer papers that are expected to be or even trying to be foundational, because the foundations already exist. And it’s not waning in the sense that scientific output has never been higher, and today’s papers are answering harder (and more specific) questions.
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#29This does not imply something is wrong with our approach now, or wrong with people now. It is a natural and unavoidable thing, that the rate must at some point slow. Newtonian mechanics is incredibly simple to figure out, as evidenced by multiple people working it out about as soon as the tools were there to do so. General relatively quite a bit harder and more complex. Whatever rules tie the quantum world to general relatively appears to be trickier still. Hopefully we get there some day.
Re: Too many new papers may mean novel ideas rarely rack up citations
#30No, it isn't waning. There are struggles, but that doesn't mean its waning. We're having massive progress in medicine, space, cosmology, environment, biology, food, transportation. Hell, the only thing that's waning is public perception of science and that seems to be a deliberate political attack.
Media coverage is terrible, which is just fine because the fields are changing so quickly that who knows where things will be in a few years, ans the invention of understandable lay explanations take a long time to develop.
I used to learn about, say, physics from popular media, but I don't get that any more. Presumably some things are going on in those fields.
I think there are two effects: the expanse of human knowledge is now so wide that the human mind is having trouble keeping up even compared to a few decades ago, and also the media has changed massively over the last few decades as internet advertising has gutted its funding model.