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Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

economist.com

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Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#111

Post by Robotbeat »

astura wrote: post #57
tobyjsullivan wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pseudo-relevant anecdote: I wanted to buy a used car a few months ago off someone on Facebook. We were meeting up same day so the easiest method seemed to be cash. I went to the bank to withdraw $7000 and was informed, much to my surprise, that it is impossible to withdraw more than $3000 without 48 hours notice. Suffice it to say, I've been seriously considering the tradeoffs of hoarding cash under my mattress.

I've always heard the best way to do this transaction is for buyer and seller to meet at buyers bank. Buyer obtains cashier's check with seller watching and hands it over to seller before leaving bank. This way seller knows cashier's check is real, you don't have to deal with large amounts of cash, and nobody's at risk of getting robbed. Downside is you have to go during banking hours and you have to make an extra tr…

That’s a really good idea.

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#112

Post by galaxyLogic »

There is the interesting history of Mansa Musa whose lavish spending of gold caused a recession. So it's not like gold is an absolutely safe asset either. It's possible we will find much more gold in Earth's mantle or on some asteroids. Then what?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mansa_Musa#Islam_and_pilgrimag...

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#114

Post by GoOnThenDoTell »

_8j50 wrote: post #98

All noncash methods of payment have strings attached where consumers and merchants alike are subject to various controls and costs. Cash is simple, exchange something in your posession for goods and services. It cannot be used as a means of identity based regulation or to audit who is buying what from whom. I mean, bitcoin exists because of how unacceptable this is to everyone but the middlemen, bureaucrats and purse…

Cash transactions have different ‘controls’ rather than being simple, like: Do I feel safe being near you? Do I feel safe letting you know I have money at all? Will you retain product after payment?

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#115

Post by garmaine »

lazide wrote: post #85
vl wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How exactly would you go about that? And how are you going to make sure you are buying gold and not gold-plated lead?

You go to a reputable dealer with cash, and buy what you want. If you’re clear you are doing a cash only deal no name, you’re good. They’ll issue you an invoice made out to walk in or whatever, so you have documentation, and if you want, you can pay taxes on gains or whatever later. It IS getting harder to get cash out of a bank without jumping through endless hoops, but most banks will still let you call in an order…

> so if a cop pulls you over you can prove it is documented/part of a ‘legal’ source

Which the cop will promptly ignore and take the money anyway.

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#116

Post by yholio »

anm89 wrote: post #27

I remember reading a while back that at some point at the beginning of our time in Afghanistan, at some point we shipped multiple pallets of bundled $100 dollar bills and we had no idea where any of it went https://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/feb/08/usa.iraq1

Why, as kickbacks to the future taliban government, a.k.a the former democratic leadership of Afghanistan, of course.

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#117

Post by bserge »

_8j50 wrote: post #98

All noncash methods of payment have strings attached where consumers and merchants alike are subject to various controls and costs. Cash is simple, exchange something in your posession for goods and services. It cannot be used as a means of identity based regulation or to audit who is buying what from whom. I mean, bitcoin exists because of how unacceptable this is to everyone but the middlemen, bureaucrats and purse…

I always have cash because the bank, at any point, can decide to freeze my account until I show up in person with some arbitrary ID/documents and beg on my knees.

That's the reality for most people and they don't even realize it.

I guess once you have enough money it's different, but for an average non-millionaire chump, it's best not to trust anyone too much.

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#118

Post by bserge »

petilon wrote: post #11
h2odragon wrote: post #2

They are circulating in places beyond the borders, I assume. We let North Korea print their own$100 bills for years as a form of off the books aid, but once that stopped the underworld needed someone to provide the currency. Remember the pallets of cash being sent to Iraq?

> We let North Korea print their own $100 bills for years as a form of off the books aid That's very hard to believe. Citation needed!

Well, it's like saying "we let organized crime run rampant", implying there's a choice to stop it.

Which I now realize might be true...

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#119

Post by toast0 »

anonporridge wrote: post #106
post_from_work wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Granted I live in Japan, but I carry a coinpurse (an old camera bag) because the 10-yen, 100-yen, and 500-yen coins are so useful. Vending machines are on practically every corner here, and the drink sizes are such that $1.20 for a drink is normal. I think most US vending machines have gigantic cans of Coca-Cola / Red Bull / Monster for $3+. The US probably could get by with just $1 and $5 coins.

What's the value of coins? Paper and plastic notes seems more convenient in most cases. Metal coins seem like a case of holding onto tradition despite losing the original reason for the tradition.

Detecting quarters is a lot easier, faster, and more reliable than detecting dollar bills. Card payments really want to be made online and transaction fees are brutal for small amounts anyway, so you end up with special purpose stored value cards and all of the lost change that implies.

Plus, quarters are better to flip to make decisions than bills.

Re: Banks, gangsters and the strange resurgence of cash

#120

Post by lazide »

anonporridge wrote: post #77
dghlsakjg wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s wild. When I was a teller (15 years ago maybe) we would routinely keep around 7-10k in our drawers, and another 40k as ready money in the day safe. Granted, we were a drive up branch that dealt with commercial/retail so a lot of customers would routinely be dealing with 5k worth of cash. Other branches had similar amounts of cash though. Strange world

I've also been hit by not being able to withdraw more than about $5k cash as a retail customer without multi day notice. I do wonder if it's not all nefarious as cash has become drastically less common over the past couple decades. Still, it's especially interesting because the numbers even 15 years ago are much higher in real terms than today. This is another advantage of inflation. You can set rules like, you have…

Cash is a bit of a pain to deal with, and most branches all normal withdrawals are going to be via the ATM anyway.

Cash is also a security risk and liability from a ‘getting robbed’ perspective.

So it’s rare to really need more anymore, except for outlier situations like car sales, which they generally don’t handle well.

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