Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 136 posts

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#111

Post by sean12345 »

sean12345 wrote: post #107
yariang wrote: post #98

I keep getting a "Could not find sprockets-2.0.0.beta.10 in any of the sources" error when I try to bundle install. Anyone know what may be causing this?

In the gem file change the rails version to gem 'rails', '~> 3.1.0.rc6'., then run bundle update. I also had an issue with the rake gem and resolved it with gem uninstall rake. Evidently the rake gem gets installed twice or something. Note, I am using Ruby 1.9.2, rvm.

The project is pretty good but not quite polished. For example the UI could be improved. There is no indication that anything has happened after signing up an account other than by checking the server log. The messaging system could use some work. Entering in a user name for the message recipient is kind of buggy.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#112

Post by badclient »

mgkimsal wrote: post #108
badclient wrote: post #106

Join the party. As someone who was recently ripped for $12k+, it's nice to see folks fighting back. In my case the work I did continues to remain online and in use by the original owner while I try to get l my client(who runs a sham design agency) into jail for writing returned checks--and having a history and a prior conviction of doing so.

This sham agency isn't in New York city by any chance, is it?

I wish(I'm in NYC). They are in San Francisco.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#113

Post by badclient »

tjmc wrote: post #109
badclient wrote: post #106

Join the party. As someone who was recently ripped for $12k+, it's nice to see folks fighting back. In my case the work I did continues to remain online and in use by the original owner while I try to get l my client(who runs a sham design agency) into jail for writing returned checks--and having a history and a prior conviction of doing so.

Have you considered using a debt collection agency? On the first consulting gig I ever did, I was owed $10K by a client who refused to pay. After months of patience, including offers to let them pay off the debt over time I went to a collection agency and got the lot back in a court settlement less $1k in fees for the agency (which at least was tax deductable). I should mention that this was in Australia and I had a…

This guy is far beyond the reach of debt collection agency. He has multiple active civil cases re: money owed. His own former lawyers have been owed money to and have obtained default judgement against him and yet have not been able to collect money as of my last conversation.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#114

Post by citricsquid »

badclient wrote: post #106

Join the party. As someone who was recently ripped for $12k+, it's nice to see folks fighting back. In my case the work I did continues to remain online and in use by the original owner while I try to get l my client(who runs a sham design agency) into jail for writing returned checks--and having a history and a prior conviction of doing so.

I don't understand how you get involved with a client like this and never take payment. Care to explain? Curious as I don't freelance. Surely you take a deposit upfront and vet the client?

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#115

Post by badclient »

citricsquid wrote: post #114
badclient wrote: post #106

Join the party. As someone who was recently ripped for $12k+, it's nice to see folks fighting back. In my case the work I did continues to remain online and in use by the original owner while I try to get l my client(who runs a sham design agency) into jail for writing returned checks--and having a history and a prior conviction of doing so.

I don't understand how you get involved with a client like this and never take payment. Care to explain? Curious as I don't freelance. Surely you take a deposit upfront and vet the client?

I did the routine vetting on google which pulled up only the good stuff: speaking engagements at conferences like ad:tech and multiple interviews. "Pretty legit guy" I thought.

It wasn't until three returned checks, barrage of excuses and threats that I came out of my delusion and realized the guy is a scumbag. A true scumbag: the original client that his agency was hired by had paid the agency--probably several times what was owed to me. And yet, the schmuck owner of the agency thought it'd be better to cheap me than pay me my fair slice of what he made.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#116

Post by badclient »

idlewords wrote: post #80
tptacek wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're a small company relative to the kinds of companies who usually contract out dev or tech work, and we will pay something up front. Probably closer to 25% than 50%, but we wouldn't get mad if you asked 50%. I'm saying this as a data point for people just getting started who might be nervous about asking for payment up front. If we'll do it, I'm sure many other people will too. It's a reasonable request. On the ot…

An additional wrinkle is that oftentimes it can take a while to set up the mechanics of payment with a first-time client. So even if there is goodwill on both sides and a willingness to pay an initial deposit, you might not see the money until you've done quite a lot of work. Since a lot of contract work is time-sensitive, waiting for payment to clear before starting work or handing over an initial milestone might no…

Since a lot of contract work is time-sensitive, waiting for payment to clear before starting work or handing over an initial milestone might not be an option.

Sums up my life as a contractor. The most profitable projects were also the most time-sensitive(the start now types).

Then again, I sucked at this. And so I took my first full-time job.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#117

Post by robryan »

tptacek wrote: post #82
idlewords wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An additional wrinkle is that oftentimes it can take a while to set up the mechanics of payment with a first-time client. So even if there is goodwill on both sides and a willingness to pay an initial deposit, you might not see the money until you've done quite a lot of work. Since a lot of contract work is time-sensitive, waiting for payment to clear before starting work or handing over an initial milestone might no…

This is a great thing to keep in mind before any of you think of writing an outraged blog post when a client doesn't honor Net+30 on your first invoice cycle. Clients usually don't.

What do you think of putting less than +30? I've only ever done any large work with long standing clients that pay quickly. Would the majority of clients not agree to it? Could be a way to ensure that it ends up being +30 even with the client dragging their feet.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#118

Post by tptacek »

robryan wrote: post #117
tptacek wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great thing to keep in mind before any of you think of writing an outraged blog post when a client doesn't honor Net+30 on your first invoice cycle. Clients usually don't.

What do you think of putting less than +30? I've only ever done any large work with long standing clients that pay quickly. Would the majority of clients not agree to it? Could be a way to ensure that it ends up being +30 even with the client dragging their feet.

You can ask for whatever you want. You'll only run into problems with BigCo's if you do one of two bad things:

* Refuse to sign unless the BigCo agrees to your payment terms.

* Actually expect the BigCo to perceive time elapsing in a way that will get you paid in 30 +/- small n days.

They won't get offended when you ask for net+15. They might even agree. But you're getting paid when the stars align, not when you think the contract says you're getting paid. Established consultancies devote a small but palpable bit of effort managing this issue.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#119

Post by tptacek »

lsc wrote: post #110
tptacek wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great thing to keep in mind before any of you think of writing an outraged blog post when a client doesn't honor Net+30 on your first invoice cycle. Clients usually don't.

oh man, this. So I've been doing contracting forever; usually direct to smaller companies or through a middleman who was also pretty small. And most of the time, smaller companies are pretty good about paying on time, and pretty responsive if you say "Hey, this is really important to me, I've gotta pay the power bill." (my power bill, well, let's just say it could buy my car every month.) At my first contracting gig…

They might not even be trying to "stretch" it (a large company could give a crap about the float on an indie consulting invoice); they might just run accounts payable on a state machine in which the part that elapses a timer hasn't started yet. There might be all manner of reasonable reasons for doing it that way; for instance, if they accidentally release payment early, they may screw up projects by blowing expectations.

In any case, yeah: some of your best clients will do a terrible job paying you on time. 'slife in the big leagues.

Re: Developer open-sources 200+ hr project after client refuses to pay

#120

Post by Unregistered »

robryan wrote: post #117
tptacek wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great thing to keep in mind before any of you think of writing an outraged blog post when a client doesn't honor Net+30 on your first invoice cycle. Clients usually don't.

What do you think of putting less than +30? I've only ever done any large work with long standing clients that pay quickly. Would the majority of clients not agree to it? Could be a way to ensure that it ends up being +30 even with the client dragging their feet.

Its hard to change "policy" at larger companies, however offering a discount for early payment can help.
Post reply on HN