Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special • Hacker News Board

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#51

Post by falcolas » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:35 PM UTC

NikolaeVarius wrote: post #47

falcolas wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Christians are not an oppressed minority, in any sense of either word. Nor is the CCP. Both of those parties represent real power, both politically and financially, in this world today.

Thats what you claim. If you talk to many Christians, they 100% believe they are being oppressed and that secularists and Atheists are coming to destroy their faith. Who are you to deny their grievances. As for the CCP, there are plenty that claim that anti-CCP is anti-Chinese racism and has no place on the stage

> Who are you to deny their grievances.

Someone who looks at them and sees that they are the majority religion in the Western world, and have politicians everywhere pushing their talking points and morals on everybody else.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#52

Post by NikolaeVarius » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:36 PM UTC

HelloMcFly wrote: post #48

throwaway210222 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The problem with such a trite comment is that is is just as true in North Korea. You are complete Free™ to say what you like about Supreme Leader Grand Marshal Kim Jong-un, but you know - there might be consequences.

There's quite a bit of difference between government-imposed consequences and social consequences. Otherwise in a sense we're all "free" to murder and steal, everywhere, in every country.

Struggle Sessions were a social consequence of being part of the "bad guys", a way to use society to stamp out "bad thoughts"

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#53

Post by throwaway894345 » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

JohnWhigham wrote: post #9

Bill Burr said it best: everyone always laughs at the jokes about other groups, but when the jokes are about their group, they can never handle them.

Way back before 2010 people would make jokes about every group and most of us handled them pretty well. That was back before the "everything is violence" people came to power.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#54

Post by NikolaeVarius » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:38 PM UTC

falcolas wrote: post #51

NikolaeVarius wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thats what you claim. If you talk to many Christians, they 100% believe they are being oppressed and that secularists and Atheists are coming to destroy their faith. Who are you to deny their grievances. As for the CCP, there are plenty that claim that anti-CCP is anti-Chinese racism and has no place on the stage

> Who are you to deny their grievances. Someone who looks at them and sees that they are the majority religion in the Western world, and have politicians everywhere pushing their talking points and morals on everybody else.

Once again, that is what you claim, in the same way that right-wingers point to the fact that we have had a black-president so racism isn't a problem anymore.

Why do your claims have more truthiness than theirs?

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#55

Post by codyswann » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:41 PM UTC

throwaway210222 wrote: post #42

falcolas wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The disparagement is a direct consequence of his speech. He is no more free from that consequence than your or I would be in similar circumstances.

> As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The problem with such a trite comment is that is is just as true in North Korea. You are complete Free™ to say what you like about Supreme Leader Grand Marshal Kim Jong-un, but you know - there might be consequences.

Not true. Freedom of speech in the US prevents the US government for levying consequences against you for what you said. This is not the case in North Koreas

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#56

Post by falcolas » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:41 PM UTC

throwaway210222 wrote: post #42

falcolas wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The disparagement is a direct consequence of his speech. He is no more free from that consequence than your or I would be in similar circumstances.

> As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The problem with such a trite comment is that is is just as true in North Korea. You are complete Free™ to say what you like about Supreme Leader Grand Marshal Kim Jong-un, but you know - there might be consequences.

So, are you saying that people shouldn't be held to the consequences of their actions, because the North Korean government does the same?

Pretty sure that's a logical fallacy: Reductio ad absurdum to be specific. And that's on top of the difference between the State and its power lawfully backed by lethal force and society which lacks the same.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#57

Post by falcolas » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

NikolaeVarius wrote: post #54

falcolas wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Who are you to deny their grievances. Someone who looks at them and sees that they are the majority religion in the Western world, and have politicians everywhere pushing their talking points and morals on everybody else.

Once again, that is what you claim, in the same way that right-wingers point to the fact that we have had a black-president so racism isn't a problem anymore. Why do your claims have more truthiness than theirs?

Because my claims are falsifiable?

Christianity accounts for 2.3 Billion people in the world, the next highest is Islam at 1.9 Billion. Unaffiliated (of which Athiests are only a portion) is only 1.2 Billion worldwide. Thus, Christianity is, by definition, a majority.

In one example to prove my second point, politicians in Texas are pushing Christian morality around abortion into laws. This is the opposite of being oppressed.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#58

Post by mc32 » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

HelloMcFly wrote: post #48

throwaway210222 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As is often stated, the freedom of speech is not the freedom of consequences. The problem with such a trite comment is that is is just as true in North Korea. You are complete Free™ to say what you like about Supreme Leader Grand Marshal Kim Jong-un, but you know - there might be consequences.

There's quite a bit of difference between government-imposed consequences and social consequences. Otherwise in a sense we're all "free" to murder and steal, everywhere, in every country.

Scarlet letters, ostracism, outcasting, etc., those are the civilian analogues and are just as palatable as the governmental version.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#59

Post by tmaly » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:53 PM UTC

mc32 wrote: post #3

Many things are upsetting to many people. I don't think it's viable to always bow to demands of your most strident members. Chapelle is a dissenter, I think he has as much a right to express his opinion as other provocateurs. We've had shows from Netflix which border on child exploitation and skate somewhat close to CP. So, why would this be out of line? I watched it and it was biting but wasn't hateful. It questione…

I watch the special, it definitely was not hateful. The end was not as funny as I expected.

I don't recall staff walking out over the Cuties movie. That definitely was pushing the line.

Re: Netflix braces for staff walkout and LGBTQ rally over Chappelle special

#60

Post by throwaway894345 » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 2:54 PM UTC

JohnWhigham wrote: post #35

yetihehe wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen this effect with programming jokes or jokes about programmers. Typical reactions I've seen are always "yeah, so true". But this is only one anecdote, I may be in a bubble, so I ask others: have you seen programmers getting offended by jokes about programmers?

I think it depends how much a certain label/group is core to one's identity. For many people in the Twittersphere, they worship the idea of labbelling themselves and showing it off to others for some reason.

While this is true, I think it kind of understates the problem. The issue isn't just "a few vain people put too much emphasis on their superficial group identities", but rather they are part of a broader ideological contingent that puts tremendous emphasis on everyone's superficial group identities. These folks generally believe that these identities are useful bases for decision making (i.e., discrimination in the most literal sense of the term) because to know a person's superficial identities is to completely understand that person. It might be controversial to say (i.e., go ahead and take my Internet Points), but it seems to plainly run completely counter to the equality ideology that gave us the civil rights movement and popularized "tolerance" as a virtue.