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Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

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Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#71

Is it just me, or are American settlements against tech companies always laughably small compared to Europe and elsewhere?

One counter-point, FB settled with the US FTC for $5B. I think that's larger than any EU fine I know of.

(It might generally be true, but it is provably not always true.)

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#72
post #37
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I want a low unemployment rate so I can pay less in taxes due to the costs of welfare.

High skill immigrants are net pay tax payers, they help reduce the need to tax you.

They also send billions overseas as opposed to Americans who spend their money in country.

Its a complex situation filled with lies of omission.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#73
post #22

The elephant in the room: make it too hard to employ talented foreigners, and sooner or later companies will just open up offices there, rather than here. Remote work has only made this easier. I want smart, hard working, talented people coming to the US, myself.

If that were productive they would (and have) already done so.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#74
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not what I'm saying. If a company hires a foreigner instead of an American then that American doesn't have a job. If they don't have a job they are unemployed. If they are unemployed then they are a net cost to me the taxpayer. If we reduce unemployment we reduce the tax burden.

If they are unemployed then they are a net cost to me the taxpayer. Unemployment benefits are not paid for by you the taxpayer. They are paid by the employee during employment and by his former employer both during and after the employment period. At least that's how it was in the three states where I've opened companies.

While that is how unemployment insurance works, it is only temporary. Unemployed in the statistical sense means actively looking for work or on unemployment while in common parlance it refers to any person not currently employed. The costs of persons who are capable of being employed but are not come at great expense to the taxpayer. Foodstamps, housing assistance, healthcare and a myriad of other programs. It is far preferable to have as many citizens in the labor force as is reasonably possible.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#75
post #37
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I want a low unemployment rate so I can pay less in taxes due to the costs of welfare.

High skill immigrants are net pay tax payers, they help reduce the need to tax you.

If they are paying the taxes rather than a citizen, then no, they are not net tax payers.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#76
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want American businesses to look towards cultivating local talent first. I don't disagree with the desire to have "smart, hard working, talented people coming to the US" but from my experience big companies use H1B's as a means of getting cheaper labor and having more power/leverage over the individual.

What is your experience? I will admit I don't have much insight into WITCH. I've worked at and interviewed people at FAANGs for the past 5 years and the bar for hiring is the same.

I worked for a large corporation that is not known for being particularly tech-oriented. Think traditional big business that has a lot of technology supporting it, but the product was not software.

In my particular office, upwards of 60% of the people working there were either H1B or contractors managed by Wipro. There were plenty of job listings that looked appropriate for new graduates / people with less than 5 years of experience but these were rarely filled by non-temp/non-contractor/non-H1B folks. HR never went out of their way to recruit local talent and did the bare minimum to "post" the job. I sensed they made the jobs hard to find, but also wrote the postings in such a way that being unable to find an American willing to do the work was a self-fulfilling prophecy.

The more Machiavellian managers realized they could overwork the H1B's because of how dependent they were on sponsorship.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#77
post #2

>The tech industry broadly relies on H-1B visas to plug gaps in their technical workforce, Does America not have schools or would Facebook rather just underpay foreigners? 14$ million is peanuts compared to the scope of H1B fraud.

> compared to the scope of H1B fraud. Which is largely overblown for political gain. Some companies abuse/have abused the program - mostly large consultancies. Focus on that. H1 is a US superpower. Companies can pick brains among the entire planet(many of those brains WANT to be picked). At essentially no cost to the country. Yes, each one will 'take' a job, but how many jobs are created by immigrants? The yearly cap…

> how many jobs are created

Yeah, somebody has to drive their taxis, clean their clothes, sweep their floors and serve their coffee.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that's only the case if company intentionally delays application process for green card, which usually takes 1.5 year (unless applicant is form the country that hit the per-country limit, like India). 1.5 year "guaranteed" retention is not that significant to deal with visas/GC. Companies that do intentionally delay the GC process, that's different story, they can stretch the application for many years and have lever…

> which usually takes 1.5 year In my experience it takes WAY longer than that, just on processing times. As in, I've never even heard of anyone getting permanent residency that quickly, at least for employment-based. If you are talking about marriage or family-based, sure. Any audits or RFEs during the process and you are looking easily at twice the time you quoted. Probably even more - given the recent delays in the…

I'm at almost 3 years for a marriage based petition currently (US citizen no less). The grass isn't that much greener on the other side, the immigration system isn't scaled to the volume of applicants at any step of the process.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#79
post #69

It’s a relic of a broken process. If you want to keep a foreign worker beyond 6 years, you can’t do that without applying for a greencard which in turn requires you to prove you don’t have a US citizen vying for the job, which should make sense. However the problem here is that the government instead of keeping a track of the country’s labor needs, outsourced this responsibility to the companies and that’s where the…

Couldn't companies also use the 6 years that they employ a foreigner to train an American worker to fill the position? A bachelors program is only 4 years and the company could sponsor it if they were in such desperate need.

top comment so far! exactly correct!

believe it or not companies would actually hire junior staff and train them up on the job and promote from within. let 's get back to that.

Re: Facebook Settles with U.S. Gov over Improperly Reserving Jobs for Immigrants

#80
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to the topic of H1-B exploitation, there is no way I'm going to say that it doesn't exist. But I will say that there is a huge gap between FAANG H1B, and Tata/Infosys/etc H1B abuse.

This. FAANGS have the money and the high end needs to use H1-B correctly. If they aren't doing it right, they have no excuse. More visas should be directed toward companies that are doing the right thing.

H1B is supposed to be about guest workers for short-term needs. Treating H1Bs as long-term career staffers who are going to buy houses, have kids, climb the ladder, etc. in the way that FAANG do, is a different kind of misuse, but it's also not in keeping with the spirit of the program.
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