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Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

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Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#81

Post by KaiserPro »

picardythird wrote: post #69
pesenti wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I encourage you to read the details of the news, in particular how the data was collected with full consent from all (something that most research datasets don’t do well). It doesn’t answer your question directly but gives you an idea on how we think about these issues. AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

One of the features outlined in the article for this post was for the glasses to remember things that other people said. How would such other people who don't want to be recorded for these purposes opt out?

This is a static dataset. You'll want to ask that question about "Project Aria".

for example, can FB provide a list of recording locations and times, so I can request my image/audio removed?

How good is facebook's anonymisation system? what % of faces can be removed (on average)

Has every single piece of footage captured with Aria been anonymised?

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#82

Post by pesenti »

picardythird wrote: post #69
pesenti wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I encourage you to read the details of the news, in particular how the data was collected with full consent from all (something that most research datasets don’t do well). It doesn’t answer your question directly but gives you an idea on how we think about these issues. AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

One of the features outlined in the article for this post was for the glasses to remember things that other people said. How would such other people who don't want to be recorded for these purposes opt out?

That’s a good question and I don’t think we have all the answers yet. But I expect that many functionalities will need to request and get consent from 3rd parties.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#83

Post by thr0wawayf00 »

pesenti wrote: post #61
Hnrobert42 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you all doing to allow those of us that don’t want to be a part of your utopia to opt out?

I encourage you to read the details of the news, in particular how the data was collected with full consent from all (something that most research datasets don’t do well). It doesn’t answer your question directly but gives you an idea on how we think about these issues. AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

HN user asks a simple and direct question to Facebook's VP of AI:

> What are you all doing to allow those of us that don’t want to be a part of your utopia to opt out?

Answer from Facebook VP of AI:

> I encourage you to read the details of the news that doesn't actually answer your question but gives you an idea of how we think

I'm glad to see that even on a industry-specific forum like Hacker News, we can't get straight answers from people like this. Giving people "an idea of how we think" seems like a great way to stay vague enough that your thinking can change however it needs to over time to fulfill your business objectives, health or safety of the community be damned. Facebook doesn't need to give us vague "ideas", it needs to provide straightforward answers to straightforward questions.

> AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

Reading a sentence like this from a Facebook exec completely stretches credulity for me. I have zero confidence that your definition of "stringent privacy guarantees" is anything close to something that actually benefits the community as a whole.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#84

Post by prox »

pesenti wrote: post #79
mdoms wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think that most people believe Facebook privacy guarantees are worth the bits they're written in?

No but they should: https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2019/07/ftc-i...

Facebook got a penalty, but the main gripe is probably that it shouldn’t have been necessary to give one in the first place. I think what is on everyones mind is : “how can we trust a company that has a bad track record?”

I think in the coming years FB should invest more in a public conversation on these issues. How can we meet the future in a way that our data is in factuality is our data, even though it’s stored by a third party such as yourself.

Especially in light of in the FB model, where the user seems to be the product, and advertisers the client.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#85

Post by pesenti »

prox wrote: post #84
pesenti wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No but they should: https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2019/07/ftc-i...

Facebook got a penalty, but the main gripe is probably that it shouldn’t have been necessary to give one in the first place. I think what is on everyones mind is : “how can we trust a company that has a bad track record?” I think in the coming years FB should invest more in a public conversation on these issues. How can we meet the future in a way that our data is in factuality is our data, even though it’s stored by…

My point in linking to the settlement wasn't about the fine, it was about the guarantees, oversight, and accountability that came with it. Read the FTC news release, and you'll see that these are pretty extensive.

And I agree completely on the public conversation, this is why we released this dataset and why we are doing project Aria.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#86

Post by dannykwells »

pesenti wrote: post #39

I support Facebook AI. The actual news is that we are releasing an extensive egocentric dataset with associated tasks for the research community. Collecting such dataset in a private and responsible way is a significant challenge. Happy to answer any questions. https://ai.facebook.com/blog/teaching-ai-to-perceive-the-wor...

This comment needs a serious disclaimer that you are a VP of AI at Facebook. Its implied in the above, but such serious COI requires acknowledgement.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#87

Post by saiya-jin »

thr0wawayf00 wrote: post #83
pesenti wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I encourage you to read the details of the news, in particular how the data was collected with full consent from all (something that most research datasets don’t do well). It doesn’t answer your question directly but gives you an idea on how we think about these issues. AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

HN user asks a simple and direct question to Facebook's VP of AI: > What are you all doing to allow those of us that don’t want to be a part of your utopia to opt out? Answer from Facebook VP of AI: > I encourage you to read the details of the news that doesn't actually answer your question but gives you an idea of how we think I'm glad to see that even on a industry-specific forum like Hacker News, we can't get stra…

I mean, what do you expect. This is public forum, he comes honestly unanonymously in front of huge crowd already in very negative mood towards this. You can't be a VP of such a thing in one of the richest companies globally ever, and not know how to play politics and lawyering safely.

pesenti - I have respect that you come forward like this and attempting to push mankind's boundaries. Unfortunately, FB is probably the second worst company ever (first could be Palantir) to take on this. I don't trust them a attometer, and never will. Any attempt to change this attitude always ends badly, see ie Carmack.

Very mixed feelings is probably the best description I can give.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#88

Post by [deleted] »

pesenti wrote: post #39

I support Facebook AI. The actual news is that we are releasing an extensive egocentric dataset with associated tasks for the research community. Collecting such dataset in a private and responsible way is a significant challenge. Happy to answer any questions. https://ai.facebook.com/blog/teaching-ai-to-perceive-the-wor...

[deleted]

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#89

Post by pesenti »

thr0wawayf00 wrote: post #83
pesenti wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I encourage you to read the details of the news, in particular how the data was collected with full consent from all (something that most research datasets don’t do well). It doesn’t answer your question directly but gives you an idea on how we think about these issues. AI-powered wearables will have stringent privacy guarantees, both for the wearer and the people around.

HN user asks a simple and direct question to Facebook's VP of AI: > What are you all doing to allow those of us that don’t want to be a part of your utopia to opt out? Answer from Facebook VP of AI: > I encourage you to read the details of the news that doesn't actually answer your question but gives you an idea of how we think I'm glad to see that even on a industry-specific forum like Hacker News, we can't get stra…

The question was about opting out of our "utopia", I wouldn't call that a "straightforward question". If you do have a straightforward question, especially about this or another specific project, I can try to provide a straightforward answer.

Re: Facebook is researching AI systems that see, hear, remember everything you do

#90

Post by pesenti »

KaiserPro wrote: post #81
picardythird wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the features outlined in the article for this post was for the glasses to remember things that other people said. How would such other people who don't want to be recorded for these purposes opt out?

This is a static dataset. You'll want to ask that question about "Project Aria". for example, can FB provide a list of recording locations and times, so I can request my image/audio removed? How good is facebook's anonymisation system? what % of faces can be removed (on average) Has every single piece of footage captured with Aria been anonymised?

From https://about.facebook.com/realitylabs/projectaria/

"Participants will only record in either Facebook offices (once they reopen), wearers’ private homes (with consent from all members of the household), or public spaces, and won’t record in private venues without written consent from such places. Before any information gathered in a public place is made available to our researchers, it will be automatically scrubbed to blur faces and vehicle license plates."

So we anonymize all the content collected in public. I don't have the stats for the face blurring algorithm, and while you can ask for your data to be removed, we don't provide locations/times. These are good suggestions though.

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