Out of curiosity what is the best counter argument to the general thesis, eg either what positives come entangled in the hot mess or reasons it’s not a hot mess?
The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
11–20 of 94 posts
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#12“Just one dependency”. The author makes it sound like this is trivial because they have a single dependency therefore it should Just Work™. Author should have included how many node modules were installed for the one dependency. The closing statements are just mind blowing. To say vue/js don’t bother you but continue to shit on everything is a tired argument. Even bringing up PHP! What are you actually doing to make…
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#13Out of curiosity what is the best counter argument to the general thesis, eg either what positives come entangled in the hot mess or reasons it’s not a hot mess?
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#14I'm embarrassed to admit that for web development, I'm afraid to try frameworks like React/Vue/Angular as well as package managers like NPM/Yarn. So I settled on writing raw (X)HTML code and using only vanilla JavaScript APIs provided by the browser (ECMAScript standard library, DOM, multimedia, etc.). Because of this, I can't bang out complicated software quickly and easily like the stereotypical front-end developer…
I would suggest starting with a bundle created by create-react-app - you will get most of the cool tooling out of the box, and discover the usefulness of some of the libraries.
Having a live loading web app is a really neat and productive way to develop - but getting there can be daunting.
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#15I'm embarrassed to admit that for web development, I'm afraid to try frameworks like React/Vue/Angular as well as package managers like NPM/Yarn. So I settled on writing raw (X)HTML code and using only vanilla JavaScript APIs provided by the browser (ECMAScript standard library, DOM, multimedia, etc.). Because of this, I can't bang out complicated software quickly and easily like the stereotypical front-end developer…
I was nodding my head until TypeScript. I still don't like it even after years of people telling me it's the future. Maybe this is what it feels like to be older.
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#16It seems pretty reasonable process to me, I feel your pain on the wasted time and I wish github issues have something like "current answer" so we don't need to go through pages of comments to find out how to fix or workaround something. In any case, lock files are there to help and make everything more static like in other package managers that don't support the same kind of dynamism. Upgrade is just like wiping your lock file.
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#17Out of curiosity what is the best counter argument to the general thesis, eg either what positives come entangled in the hot mess or reasons it’s not a hot mess?
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#18Yeah for my new startup I decided to avoid javascript except where its absolutely necessary and then use css plus lots of server side python including template generation and system and database management. I was using spa+soa with node and angular, react and vue for years but decided to use django especially because it has a great security track record and changes very slowly and doesn't require tons of extra librar…
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#19This is a rant I can appreciate. Two subjective takes on the same subject: 1) As JavaScript became ascendant, it seems like developers lost their fear of dependencies, for some reason I don't understand. Dependencies came to be seen as "time saved" rather than "something out of your control that can hurt you." 2) When dependencies don't fit together, things fail in a way that makes it look as if the code is simply wr…
Sounds like a decent feature to include in a compiler!
Re: The JavaScript ecosystem is a hot mess and so is software development
#20I'm embarrassed to admit that for web development, I'm afraid to try frameworks like React/Vue/Angular as well as package managers like NPM/Yarn. So I settled on writing raw (X)HTML code and using only vanilla JavaScript APIs provided by the browser (ECMAScript standard library, DOM, multimedia, etc.). Because of this, I can't bang out complicated software quickly and easily like the stereotypical front-end developer…
> I made an exception for TypeScript I was nodding my head until TypeScript. I still don't like it even after years of people telling me it's the future. Maybe this is what it feels like to be older.