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Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

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Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#51

Post by d4mi3n »

colinplamondon wrote: post #47
skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

This is totally wrong. The economics of monthly billing are awful, and completely unworkable for a new startup. You have to do annual. Cost of Install: $7.00, for something this specific Trial Start Rate: 20%, if paywalled like this app is Cost Per Trial: $35 Conversion to Trial: 40% Cost Per Subscriber: $87.50 If they charge you $10/month, they can't get into the black on a new customer for 9 months. They have to ea…

The problem isn’t the cost, it’s the way folks with ADHD are being charged.

The whole point here is to help folks who are having trouble remembering to do things. Regardless of the economics, the optics here make this seem like exploitation.

Making this opt-in avoids a dark pattern. Folks with ADHD are often impulsive and strike while the iron is hot—if this has value people will opt-in.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#53

Post by endisneigh »

colinplamondon wrote: post #47
skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

This is totally wrong. The economics of monthly billing are awful, and completely unworkable for a new startup. You have to do annual. Cost of Install: $7.00, for something this specific Trial Start Rate: 20%, if paywalled like this app is Cost Per Trial: $35 Conversion to Trial: 40% Cost Per Subscriber: $87.50 If they charge you $10/month, they can't get into the black on a new customer for 9 months. They have to ea…

None of what you’re saying makes sense. If the product is amazing people will continue paying and attrition will be low, annual or not.

Basically the model here is like a gym, where people buy things that they don’t use as much as the price implies or is simply ineffective.

Given that the customers are executive function impaired, seems shady.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#54

Post by msluyter »

geocrasher wrote: post #9
n1000 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hyperfocus is actually one of the odd trades of ADHD. If people with ADHD work on a topic that motivates them, they can easily loose hours just like you describe. However, if the task is too mundane or overwhelming, I can easily procrastinate months on them.

^ This. As a 45 year old recently diagnosed with ADHD, I realize how much of my life was described by things like this. The more I learn about ADD/ADHD, the more sense I make to myself.

Isn't that crazy, that one could go 45+ years without knowing they had ADHD? It wasn't until I was... > 50yrs until someone I was talking to said "sounds like you have ADHD" and I was like "what???" But sure enough, after seeing a couple of specialists and reading up on it, turned out I had all the classic symptoms and was coping with it in a number of suboptimal ways. Knowing about it and treating it has improved my life immensely.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#55

Post by jstx1 »

symlinkk wrote: post #52

Does therapy actually work? I’ve always been under the impression that it was mostly placebo, and that only medication produces meaningful results. Happy to be proven wrong though

> I’ve always been under the impression that it was mostly placebo

I don't think placebo is relevant in the case of therapy because placebo itself is a psychological effect.

CBT seems to be somewhat effective but with these things people's experiences vary a lot.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#56

Post by colinplamondon »

d4mi3n wrote: post #51
colinplamondon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is totally wrong. The economics of monthly billing are awful, and completely unworkable for a new startup. You have to do annual. Cost of Install: $7.00, for something this specific Trial Start Rate: 20%, if paywalled like this app is Cost Per Trial: $35 Conversion to Trial: 40% Cost Per Subscriber: $87.50 If they charge you $10/month, they can't get into the black on a new customer for 9 months. They have to ea…

The problem isn’t the cost, it’s the way folks with ADHD are being charged. The whole point here is to help folks who are having trouble remembering to do things. Regardless of the economics, the optics here make this seem like exploitation. Making this opt-in avoids a dark pattern. Folks with ADHD are often impulsive and strike while the iron is hot—if this has value people will opt-in.

Why are we holding this new startup to a standard we don't hold anyone else? 6 months from now when they have their economics figured out, cool, they can run that test.

Generally, giving users a toggle to get reminded when a trial is about to run out will INCREASE conversion rates.

That depends on the business, and is part of a pretty standard set of experiments you run post-launch.

With your comments you're part HN is descending into a circular firing squad of virtue signaling. These guys shipped something that could help a lot of people, over time they can improve their onboarding flow, lower cost.

Is the most remarkable thing about a really cool CBT tool for ADHD really that they have a standard trial flow?

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#57

Post by toqy »

mStreamTeam wrote: post #30
skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

As someone with ADHD, I can confirm this model is super predatory. I cancel all my credit cards every year just to get rid of all opt-in charges on regular basis

If you aren't doing so already, you should look into if your card has virtual cards. Capital One for example does. I think it would make your current process easier.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#58

Post by dec0dedab0de »

exdsq wrote: post #12
geocrasher wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

^ This. As a 45 year old recently diagnosed with ADHD, I realize how much of my life was described by things like this. The more I learn about ADD/ADHD, the more sense I make to myself.

This sounds very much like me. Give me interesting work and I won’t stop, give me mundane work and I’ll find more interesting work till I have to do it. I’m 27, how did you end up getting diagnosed later into adult life?

I was your age when I was diagnosed, and it changed my life. I had suspected for years, and one day a friend gave me an adder all. I felt like everyone else seemed. I then found a psychiatrist that would let me book via email, and was near my work. I told him everything, including the illegal adderall, and we walked through questions and I believe his words were "you are the poster boy for adult ADHD". Within a year I had taught myself some new skills, within 5 years my salary had more than doubled.

The hardest part is making the appointments, if you have someone who will help you, ask them to. If you don't just force yourself.

Though as I put on another comment I might delete, ADHD isn't really about mundane vs interesting, at least not always. Sometimes I find myself focussed on the mundane, or ignoring the interesting and enjoyable. The pills aren't magic, and there is no cure, but if you suspect it I recommend finding help. Also, intense cardio exercise, high protein low carb diet, lots of water, and vitamins. I don't stick with any of them for long periods of time, but whenever I do it makes life easier.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#59

Post by SyzygistSix »

skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

"but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady" is so dead on. What an enormous red flag.

Might as well come right out and say that they understand ADHD and plan to use its drawbacks to make money from people. Considering how desperate a lot of people are for treatment, this sounds like a great monetary investment for people with no conscience.

This may be a bit harsh. I'm a bit salty as navigating the process to get treatment for ADHD is a continual reminder that most services are tilted towards providing services to already well-functioning people. I probably will try it, after all you did just remind me to cancel my free Prime membership, even though it was right there in bold on my day planner a week ago.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#60

Post by rubylark »

what_is_orcas wrote: post #34
skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

I mean, reading the description, it's hard not to get a little concerned: "a start up that's going to try to make money off of folks with ADHD" isn't a great starting place. I think this is sort of a broader start-up problem. Some things shouldn't be monetized (period, but for the sake of the audience, I'll add: at least not as aggressively as is required for a start-up).

Here's a counter argument: "a company making money off of folks with ____" describes the entirety of the Biomed industry. Every medical device is sold with the intention of helping people with medical issues, but they can't be free. The cost of development and production has to be covered by somebody (be that by the government, medical insurance, or private party). If it wasn't, the company making the device wouldn't have developed it in the first place.
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