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On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

rachelsruminations.com

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Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#211

Post by jwhitten »

VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #26
marstall wrote: post #12

ELI5 why she renounced her citizenship? Not getting it from that post, a 3 minute wander on her site and the FATCA Wikipedia page.

Americans living in other countries don't want to pay taxes anymore. Apparently the only option is to stop being an American, which she has decided to do.

It is not about paying taxes as its likely she was not paying any to the US. This is what the unique tax treaties cover. You still however have to prove this every year.

One of the worst parts about this situation is the difficulty in investing from abroad. Can't buy US ETFs/Mutual funds because they don't report properly abroad and can't buy foreign ETFs/Mutual funds because they don't want to report to US. This is a totally unnecessary financial burden on US Expats.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#213

Post by metagame »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #210
metagame wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't a country mean little to someone, even if it is a democracy? I live in the United States, and any theoretical vote I give is completely worthless unless I would move to Maine, and even then it's still not worth much. I move out of the United States, my vote is still worthless. I get citizenship elsewhere, my vote might have a chance at value. The United States doesn't actually do much for its citizens; i…

I've always wondered how people in the green card immigration queue, sometimes estimated to take 20 years until their turn, feel when they read someone like you failing to value the country they live in at all.

Probably skeptic, because they lived elsewhere, got an education for relatively inexpensive or free, and all they see is the difference in the value of currency.

Or probably skeptic, because they're planning on moving to a good state.

Or most probably, they don't care. They're moving countries, they probably don't have the most nationalistic bent to them.

I don't hate the United States, I'm just not being unrealistic about how beneficial it's been for me.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#214

Post by em3rgent0rdr »

matttproud wrote: post #112
voisin wrote: post #16

The conversation here at this moment seems to be focused solely on whether or not it is complicated or costly to keep filing US taxes. This misses the point in that the US is the _only_ developed country to impose worldwide taxation on its citizens regardless of where they live. The only other country to do so is Eritrea and the US has routinely criticized them for doing so. Moreover, it makes expats ineligible for c…

American who‘s been abroad for a decade: I 100% agree. It introduces a lot of friction, complexity, and annoyance. Beyond taxation, the limitations with American institutions when being domiciled abroad put you into a terrible edge-case with needing to crutch on someone stateside with an address. So much stupidity. One addendum: while FATCA is newish and bad, the concept of taxation of Americans abroad dates back to…

> "the concept of taxation of Americans abroad dates back to the Civil War period"

I'm not surprised, but could you provide some references on this...I am curious to read.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#215

Post by Hamuko »

ryanlol wrote: post #207

Rachel isn’t any better than the restauranteur displaying a “no blacks” sign. It’s not cool to block entire countries from your blog just because.

I thought it was cool since American websites have been blocking European countries for years now.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#216

Post by Hamuko »

op00to wrote: post #182
noasaservice wrote: post #101

> then charging me $2350 to file the divorce papers. So, if I understand correctly, the very fact that I was squirted out here in this country puts me at a -$2350 just for being born. So US citizenship = -$2350

Really? you were squirted out into a modern society managed by modern government institutions. Ignoring the fact that you’re discounting the miracle of life, you certainly took advantage of more than $2350 of services upon birth. Security, med school funding, Medicare hospital funding, road infrastructure…

You're assuming that the person in this scenario ever actually lived in the US. You can get an American citizenship without ever actually living there, which will then just make your life harder and if you want to make your life easier, that'll be $2350.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#217

Post by jkepler »

digbybk wrote: post #160
Lordarminius wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm interested in knowing:how is citizenship a legal fiction ?

It exists only when people believe it exists. If no one believed in your citizenship, your passport would just be a little notebook with no value. When going from a world without citizenship to a world with it, nothing needs to change outside of the human brain. In that sense, it’s a fiction.

No. A passport says what country must take you when other places decide to deport you or refuse you entry.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#218

Post by withinboredom »

em3rgent0rdr wrote: post #214
matttproud wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American who‘s been abroad for a decade: I 100% agree. It introduces a lot of friction, complexity, and annoyance. Beyond taxation, the limitations with American institutions when being domiciled abroad put you into a terrible edge-case with needing to crutch on someone stateside with an address. So much stupidity. One addendum: while FATCA is newish and bad, the concept of taxation of Americans abroad dates back to…

> "the concept of taxation of Americans abroad dates back to the Civil War period" I'm not surprised, but could you provide some references on this...I am curious to read.

Just guessing, but I assume the Union wanted to continue to tax the Confederates who no longer lived in the Union because even though the succeeded from the Union, they were still Union citizens by birth.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#219

Post by usr1106 »

welder wrote: post #85
throw63738 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In practice US citizens have it difficult to even open simple bank account. Most foreign companies prefer not to deal with US gov.

Yes! Banks in Germany would flatly say "we can't help you" when I pulled out my US passport. The only one I could get was Number26, which is technically only an online bank account.

N26 is in the headlines for money laundering incompliance. Probably not at all related to average American expats, but as soon as they strengthen their processes they might find it the easiest not to do business with a couple of Americans.

Re: On Receiving my Certificate of Loss of Nationality

#220

Post by usr1106 »

hbrav wrote: post #167
throw63738 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is good business for gov, so of course it fails. There is something similar that happens regularly. Perhaps look at gaining citizenship at country that allows only single citizenship. It should make American citizenship null and void.

Germany is such a country. However, as part of granting you citizenship they do a search for other countries that you have citizenship of. I believe they will not grant you German citizenship until you have relinquished your other citizenship. I suppose another test case would be if you were to apply for German citizenship following your unilateral renunciation.

You can get double citizenship in Germany by birth and if the other country does generally not grant loss if nationality. Some other exception I don't recall by heart, but generally not.

And nowadays without difficulty if the other country is a EU country. But that is a deviation from German law tradition EU has forced on them.

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