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Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

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Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#31

Nailed for being the only guy stupid enough to write instant messages bragging about misleading the FAA. As a longtime corporate grunt, I can guess exactly how management leaned on him. He should have left and let the scumbags find another patsy to do their dirty work.

Exactly. There's a reason when you deal with people senior enough in any big organization that everything is verbal...

And there is a reason why lawyers exist.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#32
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? He was lying to them as well.

> Steve Jobs told employees a short story when they were promoted to vice president at Apple. Jobs would tell the VP that if the garbage in his office was not being emptied, Jobs would naturally demand an explanation from the janitor. "Well, the lock on the door was changed,' the janitor could reasonably respond. "And I couldn't get a key." > The janitor's response is reasonable. It's an understandable excuse. The ja…

This makes a lot of sense. When you are high enough you are so far away from the trenches that the only responsibilities are: 1) Making decisions and 2) Taking blames for whatever reason. That's why you get the big bucks.

Extrapolated from that, I kinda understand why many senior employees do NOT want to climb the pole but instead staying closer to the trenches.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

some C-level staff eventually has to take some responsibility That may be optimistic. Off the top of my head I can't remember any c-level execs of such a massive corporation having criminal charges brought against them. (except maybe for some type of tax/securities fraud) There's probably... some? My knowledge of the area certainly isn't comprehensive.

What happened to the Enron guys? Didn't they go to jail? I know one commited suicide, but the othe 2 spent some time at Club Fed didn't they?

Ken Lay (Chairman, CEO) had a heart attack and died, not suicide. Jeffrey Skilling (CEO) was initially sentenced to 24 years, later reduced to 14, served 12. Andrew Fastow (CFO) was sentenced to 6 years, served 5.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#34
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? He was lying to them as well.

> Steve Jobs told employees a short story when they were promoted to vice president at Apple. Jobs would tell the VP that if the garbage in his office was not being emptied, Jobs would naturally demand an explanation from the janitor. "Well, the lock on the door was changed,' the janitor could reasonably respond. "And I couldn't get a key." > The janitor's response is reasonable. It's an understandable excuse. The ja…

I guess this was before the big brain genius man treated his fatal cancer with magic beans.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#35
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened to the Enron guys? Didn't they go to jail? I know one commited suicide, but the othe 2 spent some time at Club Fed didn't they?

Ken Lay (Chairman, CEO) had a heart attack and died, not suicide. Jeffrey Skilling (CEO) was initially sentenced to 24 years, later reduced to 14, served 12. Andrew Fastow (CFO) was sentenced to 6 years, served 5.

Thanks for the correction.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#36
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? He was lying to them as well.

> Steve Jobs told employees a short story when they were promoted to vice president at Apple. Jobs would tell the VP that if the garbage in his office was not being emptied, Jobs would naturally demand an explanation from the janitor. "Well, the lock on the door was changed,' the janitor could reasonably respond. "And I couldn't get a key." > The janitor's response is reasonable. It's an understandable excuse. The ja…

Sounds like the mafia.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#37
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately it looks like this is really a fall guy with no mention of where the instruction to hide this information came from. On the other hand, according to his Linkedin Mark Forkner worked for the FAA before moving to Boeing to become the chief technical pilot, so he should have been well aware of the stakes when he hid information.

It's likely he thought FAA self certification [1] would allow Boeing to skate by, which is probably accurate if the planes hadn't fallen out of the sky. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/how-the-faa-al...

Which is generally why in other areas a corporation may have its own verification/validation processes, but bring in a 3rd party to audit them. It's a common accounting process.

Although, as we saw with Arthur Anderson, that 3rd party isn't always so neutral. And, by virtue of getting paid by the company, may deliver the results wanted instead of the results that are accurate.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#39

Nailed for being the only guy stupid enough to write instant messages bragging about misleading the FAA. As a longtime corporate grunt, I can guess exactly how management leaned on him. He should have left and let the scumbags find another patsy to do their dirty work.

Exactly. There's a reason when you deal with people senior enough in any big organization that everything is verbal...

I do not know if these discussions happened in WA, but WA had one party consent audio recording laws instead of all party consent, then executives would be more wary of instructing underlings to do something illegal.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#40

Nailed for being the only guy stupid enough to write instant messages bragging about misleading the FAA. As a longtime corporate grunt, I can guess exactly how management leaned on him. He should have left and let the scumbags find another patsy to do their dirty work.

Exactly. There's a reason when you deal with people senior enough in any big organization that everything is verbal...

Just to nitpick, you probably mean 'oral'
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