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Michelin Airless

michelin.com

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Re: Michelin Airless

#241

Post by djrogers »

Pxtl wrote: post #220
bkanber wrote: post #13

Former automotive engineer chiming in. "Tweels" have been around a long time, but have always failed in terms of "NVH" (noise, vibration, harshness). Michelin is claiming that this generation of tweels are appropriate for passenger cars, which means that they think they've solved the NVH problem. They seem to be marketing these alongside EVs, I wonder if they're only really intended for lighter, compact-style cars. (…

EVs don't have space to store a donut so an airless system that can't deflate would be useful.

That's malarkey. EVs have more than enough space for a donut. If manufacturers choose to not ship one, that's because they can same $$ and weight by not doing so - it's not due to space.

Re: Michelin Airless

#242

Post by bserge »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #173
8ytecoder wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't get me wrong - I'd expect Michelin to have done some testing to see NVH is within tolerance levels right? Airless is really close to working for bikes. If I were commuting on a bike now I'd be comfortable going for it. The downsides - painfully hard installation, uphill resistance, ...etc. - will be worth it.

Really? There are small cans of spray which you can have easily with you. Got a flat? Look where, pull it out. Spray the foam in. Turn the wheel for a minute, look for overseen leaks, maybe, and pull stuff out of them. Turn wheel a few more times. Pump. Or use car-adapter for pump at gas station. Those stuff costs between 2 and 4€ for a can of sprayfoam, and maybe 50ct for a small adapter(sugar cube like, but cylindr…

I just used aramid fiber lining on the inside of my Vee Rubber tires (best stuff, fuck Conti and Schwalbe), haven't had a flat yet. Better than "puncture proof" shit from Conti.

But it's probably just a matter of time before an exotically shaped piece of glass gets through :D

Re: Michelin Airless

#243

Post by gambiting »

bserge wrote: post #232
kllrnohj wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Air-less tires have been working fine for decades: https://www.nasa.gov/specials/wheels/ You'll also find industrial equipment examples like https://www.sourceproequipment.com.au/crocodile-skid-steer-b... As the person you're replying to said, though, the problem for passenger cars is NVH. They aren't quiet. Even with that downside, though, they are still used in consumer-facing applications like some bike sharing pr…

What the hell, I've been looking for something like this for the past few months. Only ones I could find were Tannus (too soft) and Schwalbe (garbage). Don't care about weight, noise, ride quality, just need unbreakable tires because riding through neighborhoods where people break glass bottles on the bike paths will make me smash someone's head with one someday.

How about just regular Schwalbe Marathons Plus? In my experience those tyres are literally unpuncturable(at the cost of a huge weight penalty).

Re: Michelin Airless

#244

Post by tynpeddler »

Cool stuff. I hope they make it onto the road. What was really interesting to me is that the page suggests that most of their on road testing is done in the US. Michelin is a French company and there are lots of good European card companies. Does anyone know why they wouldn't do their testing in Europe?

Re: Michelin Airless

#245

Post by modeless »

andylynch wrote: post #229
AStrangeMorrow wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I am wrong, but I think I've red somewhere that these are made to be re-threaded. Meaning when the outer layer get damaged with use, instead of changing the whole tire, just the outer part can be replaced. Not too sure how that works though. If that is the case, it should help reduce the amount of waste by a lot. Plus even if these new tires are heavier, I doubt they are 10 times heavier either. I'd be surprise…

They call it ‘recharging’ on this page. They even propose converting between summer/winter by reprinting the tread.

Pneumatic tires can also be retreaded. But we generally don't do it for passenger cars. I'm not sure of the reasons why so I can't say whether these tires address any of them. I'd want to see some explanation before I believe it.

Re: Michelin Airless

#246

Post by rolleiflex »

bkanber wrote: post #13

Former automotive engineer chiming in. "Tweels" have been around a long time, but have always failed in terms of "NVH" (noise, vibration, harshness). Michelin is claiming that this generation of tweels are appropriate for passenger cars, which means that they think they've solved the NVH problem. They seem to be marketing these alongside EVs, I wonder if they're only really intended for lighter, compact-style cars. (…

Do you think something like this would be made available for motorcycle tires? Motorcycles are significantly more vulnerable to tire-caused crashes because a motorcycle whose one tire violently decompresses on a highway or autobahn is very likely to have a crash since it can no longer balance, while a car that loses a tire still has 3 other tires and will still have plenty of traction and balance left to pull over. Something like this that makes violent decompression impossible would be a fairly big improvement to motorcycle safety.

Re: Michelin Airless

#247

Post by WorldMaker »

thefounder wrote: post #202
noobermin wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for the conversation pivot, but this attitude sucks and is terrible for climate change and was decided wholesale by suppliers. While SUVs are leading sales in the US, it was the decision by car manufacturers to discontinue sales of anything other than SUVs in the US. That you say, "well these wheels which would reduce waste aren't useful for Americans," they are partly not useful because the car industry here p…

Nah...americans like big cars and manufacturers followed the sales! Even worse, europeans started to like big cars too...I just don't get why people like to drive big SUVs in the city.

"Like" is a strong word.

On the one side you've got the tragedy of the commons that is big vehicles are less safe for other people to be around unless they two are in a big vehicle.

On the other side, Tesla, Toyota, Honda, and Nissan still all have relatively strong sales of sedans in the US. The US market decided that sedans were best from "imports" decades ago and GM/Ford just gave up trying to compete. Then there's of course Tesla telling GM/Ford exactly where the hockey puck was going if they wanted to compete with "imports".

Re: Michelin Airless

#248

Post by drawkbox »

Yizahi wrote: post #16

I don't worry about punctures at all, despite living in a country with a shitty roads. What I worry about A LOT is a catastrophic collision of tire with a 90 degree sharp pothole edge, often made by roadworkers before doing point repair, which potentially can destroy tire irreparably. I wonder if these tires are better protected against such impacts, and just looking at them it seems they are - no side walls which ar…

Additionally, tires filled with air can be dangerous over or under filling them.

Filling tires at too high pressure can lead to blowouts.

Filling tires under pressure leads to degraded performance handling issues potentially causing accidents in some cases.

A more consistent normalized baseline performing tire, even if louder, would be welcome. This would end the seasonal low pressure tires in winter due to the cold and higher pressure during summer due to the heat.

One time we got new tires and went on vacation and parked our car in an outside parking garage in a hot summer for a week, we came back and the side facing the sun the tires had exceeded PSI max and started to buckle. I am sure we have all seen those videos of people standing over tires and overfilling them leading to essentially a pressure bomb. Managing air pressure in tires can be problematic, airless tires are a welcome innovation.

Re: Michelin Airless

#249

Post by jacquesm »

I hope the open sides will be closed up because those are going to be grime collectors if exposed to the weather. I'd expect them to be full of crap before the first month of use is out.

Edit: apparently they are.

Re: Michelin Airless

#250

Post by Pxtl »

djrogers wrote: post #241
Pxtl wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EVs don't have space to store a donut so an airless system that can't deflate would be useful.

That's malarkey. EVs have more than enough space for a donut. If manufacturers choose to not ship one, that's because they can same $$ and weight by not doing so - it's not due to space.

I drive a compact PHEV and there is literally no place to even put a spare, but that may be more because it's a PHEV and so it has to make room for both batteries and engine. I know most compact EVs don't come with spares and many don't even have a well to store one in.
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