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Is going to the office a broken way of working?

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Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#301

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

soylentnewsorg wrote: post #287
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To each their own, but to be honest I'm always baffled, and quite saddened, by this "don't make friends at work" "advice". I've made many, many friends at work, and this near-paranoia level of "you might be pissing off someone else" - so what? I don't need, or want, to be friends with everyone, and I'm quite fine if some people don't like me.

Because you're at work to have a good career and get paid. >so what so they talk behind your back, and that's not good for a work environment. so if any of them are in management, they will impede your career. so eventually when one of those guys you pissed off has a couple of beers too many at a company outing, he is going to talk office-inappropriate crap, and despite what you might think that is bad not just for h…

Look, like I said, to each their own. From your posts it seems quite clear you have no problem not being friends with people at work. More power to you.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#302

Post by Valkhyr »

jimmaswell wrote: post #278
IggleSniggle wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First off, if you're not vaccinated, it's really a lot less safe for you for me to be around you. I don't really want to be responsible for getting you or your family sick. But beyond that, if I can't trust you to take very basic precaution of vaccinating, can I trust you to take the much more obnoxious precaution of masking up, or the still more inconvenient precaution of social distancing generally? Or quarantining…

> masking up, or the still more inconvenient precaution of social distancing generally? Or quarantining after travel? Why would I still be doing any of that when I'm vaccinated and no longer required?

The vaccine does not make you fully immune, and the vaccine does not necessarily prevent you carrying and transmitting the virus. It just makes it less likely to happen (and you're certainly much less likely to become a coughing superspreader).

I don't know about where you live, but many places in the world have not yet reached levels of vaccination that would make make masking and social distancing redundant.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#303

Post by wolrah »

baud147258 wrote: post #258
IggleSniggle wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes. If not "everyone," certainly lots and lots of folks are just staying home whenever possible. Because we are in the middle of a global pandemic. I think this has much more to do with "we are in a global pandemic" than "you can't meet people doing remote work." Certainly, there were a number of larger groups that I used to hang out with consistently pre-pandemic, but now have totally abandoned. I'm not inter…

> Because we are in the middle of a global pandemic. Really? Maybe I forgot because here in France it feels like we've kinda gone back to business as usual, as long as one can show proof of vaccination (necessary if you want to go to the restaurants, cinemas and museums).

> as long as one can show proof of vaccination (necessary if you want to go to the restaurants, cinemas and museums).

This is the key point. If we had widespread implementation of similar restrictions we'd be around the same. Unfortunately here we have not just a lot of people but a lot of lawmakers, mayors, and governors who think not being able to spread a virus is an attack on their personal freedoms.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#304

Post by ZFtdGGXwyWIpKKv »

alchemism wrote: post #260
ZFtdGGXwyWIpKKv wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're completely unable to empathize with those of us who have families and other commitments outside of work. Being forced to travel for work to some faraway "exotic" destination is literally the worst thing ever for someone who has kids or an ailing relative or even a garden to tend to. Mandatory offsites are extremely painful for those who have strong ties to home. At my company offsites aren't mandatory: those w…

People with responsibilities in a fixed location probably should not take traveling salesperson positions, generally speaking.

Plenty of software engineers are being made to go on mandatory "retreats" regardless of whether they like it or not.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#306

Post by null_shift »

randycupertino wrote: post #296
ethbr0 wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to recommend that as well. Am in the process of reading it, after a previous recommendation on HN. Or as the previous commenter quipped to a similar question 'Yes, Robert Putnam identified all these trends by the 80s and 90s, but nobody liked how gloomy he was about it.' Link: https://www.amazon.com/Bowling-Alone-Collapse-American-Commu... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_D._Putnam

Does Bowling Alone have any suggestions on how to create a "third space" for ourselves? Or is it more just identifying the phenomena?

i am also very interested to know this as well.

the absence of “irl” community is something i have thought a lot about over the years.

seems nowadays most people hang out with either: 1. existing friends/family 2. coworkers 3. go online

with wfh, you lose #2. if you are a transplant, or never had #1, that doesn’t leave you with any options.

it seems inevitable that the future of socialization will be online and niche. and there will be a small minority that reject that trend and go “off the grid” to connect with nature.

i’m interested to research these topics/themes more thoroughly, if anyone can recommend further reading.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#307

Post by uxp100 »

Yanster wrote: post #246
ryanSrich wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, the traffic where I live is beyond anything I’ve ever seen. So clearly we’re in the tiniest minority. Most people still have to drive to work, even during a pandemic.

Traffic in and out of the capital here has reached insane levels too, despite most people with compatible jobs getting a deal with only 2 or 3 days at the office since the crisis. I know quite a few previously using public transportation 5 days a week now driving on "office" days, because they got scared of rush hour crowds. That and/or the lower car costs no longer justify the savings of using public transportation.

Lower car costs?

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#308

Post by [deleted] »

lamontcg wrote: post #184
Ancalagon wrote: post #8

I’m gonna go against the HN grain here and, despite having been fully for remote work for the first year or so of the pandemic, come out and say that life has really gotten a lot more repetitive and frankly disappointing since covid and the death of the office. I kind of miss meeting people in the office. I was in the unfortunate position of having moved to a new city for a new tech job where I knew nobody just seven…

Sounds like the problem is that our social involvement outside of work is totally broken and we make our lives revolve around our work, and think that's entirely normal.

[deleted]

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#309

Post by grouphugs »

let me tell you about a broken way of working

i have been programming since i was 14

the first programming job i wanted to get i couldn't because i was not 18 yet

so fuck it, we go through trying to do the school thing because of how things are working out

school thing did not work out

so fuck it, we try to get a job

getting a job was met with constant berratement, harassment, gas-lighting, trolling, by dipshits and their taco sauce that honestly i would still like to murder them and their families

then you finally get into a job after months of dealing with said above

then the real issues start

fuck you

fuck your country

fuck your prisons

fuck your borders

fuck your presidents

fuck your society

it's gonna die

most of you are going to die with it

get over it

no one in the future wants this bulslhit

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#310

Post by analog31 »

jstx1 wrote: post #93
dave78 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so wrong with letting every employee make their own choice? Then, after 6 months or a year or whatever (to get everyone a chance to get used to it and be confident in their selection), survey everyone to find out who wants to keep working from home. Those that don't - allocate them a desk in an office. Add some additional hoteling desks for travelers or normal WFHers who need to visit, and then adjust the size…

> What's so wrong with letting every employee make their own choice? You're inevitably forcing your colleagues into your own way of working to some extent. Imagine a team of 6 people working on the same product: If 1 is in office and 5 are remote, then the benefits of the office are largely lost even for the 1 person. That 1 person is still working in a remote model just from a different location which happens to be…

>>> You're inevitably forcing your colleagues into your own way of working to some extent.

This was already the case even for 100% on-site. It was just woven into the culture, so it didn't seem anomalous.

Before the pandemic, people still had to accommodate people with different working habits. This is where we got ideas such as hierarchies and "silos." There were unwritten rules about who was more important than who, whether they could have an office with a door, who could be interrupted and who couldn't. There were multiple channels of information that were not accessible to all.

I noticed that during the pandemic, there was as much or more communication among the rank and file, because it was easier to get lost without staying in touch. I had to be more careful about getting good information before proceeding on faulty assumptions. My group also became more global.

Oddly enough I'm back in office now, but in an isolated lab where I'm alone 90% of the time. And my team's boss is in another state.

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