131–140 of 155 posts
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The vast majority of lawn mowers are not 2 stroke.
Lawn mowers, no. But those are far from the only gas-powered lawn tools. (Also, I've never seen a catalytic converter on a four-stroke lawn mower.)
No reason they can't put catalytic converters on.
If we really want to be green, then why not require reel mowers?
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This simply isn't true. A decent push mower can be had for about $180. Cheaper ones are about $130. Do you have a source for $500+ gas push mowers? I'd imagine they are very niche companies or models. This also ignores the used market. Mine was used for $30.
The cheapest Honda push mower at home depot (today in the midwest) is $420, the second cheapest is $550. They will easily go 20 years without much maintenance. Nobody I know buying $180 mowers gets more than a few years out of them and they are off to the landfill.
If your argument is that a decent mower can go 20 years, then that excludes battery powered ones. You'll need to replace the batteries.
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From a CARB publication dated 2017 ( https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/fact-sheets/small-engines-c... ): > In the early 2020s, however, total smog-forming emissions from small engines are projected to exceed those from passenger cars in the South Coast Air Basin because passenger car emissions will continue to decrease. By 2031, small engine emissions will be more than twice those from passenger cars. And from the bil…
Ok, so that's a forecast. Not something happening now (that you claim). And how about planes, generation plants, etc?
As for airplanes, power plants and other large-scale users of fossil fuels: like cars and unlike gas-powered lawn tools, they tend to more carefully manage combustion to burn cleaner, and power plants can treat exhaust (like cars do with catalytic converters). So those sources are cleaner per gallon of fuel than a gas-powered leaf blower, and they don't exhaust quite as close to living, breathing people.
The part of this that is actually worrying to me is this also includes gas, diesel, and propane powered electric generators. My parents live multiple hours north of the bay in the woods along the border of Jackson state forest and rely on their generator a few times a year. Their property is heavily wooded (lots of coastal redwoods) and on the north facing side of a mountain (it’s in the shade most of the day for mos…
The article mentions that the restrictions for generators aren't planned to take effect until much later (2028), and that can be postponed by CARB. Also, it's only for portable generators. If you're relying on generator power multiple times per year, it probably makes sense to get one permanently installed.
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Lawn mowers, no. But those are far from the only gas-powered lawn tools. (Also, I've never seen a catalytic converter on a four-stroke lawn mower.)
They are the primary one. No reason they can't put catalytic converters on. If we really want to be green, then why not require reel mowers?
The cost of the catalytic converter itself, plus the advanced ECU necessary to make it work properly would make gas-powered lawn mowers more expensive than an electric plus a pile of spare batteries.
> If we really want to be green, then why not require reel mowers?
Grow up.
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That's going to be a tough sell for landscapers currently getting by with a 25 year old F150. If the state is forcing these costs onto working people like this, they should also subsidize the cost to get newer legal equipment. The state of california already offers funding for wealthy people to buy Teslas, they should do something for day laborers too.
Landscapers currently getting by with a 25 year old F150 can continue to also get by with their existing tools. They won't need a new F-150 to serve as a generator until they are well into the process of retiring their gas-powered tools in favor of electric tools. And there will even be a grace period of several years where they can start migrating to electric tools and buy a separate generator. Because these rules a…
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Ok, so that's a forecast. Not something happening now (that you claim). And how about planes, generation plants, etc?
I didn't claim it's happening now. The state legislature of California did: " The Legislature finds and declares all of the following ..." I don't know for sure that the legislators who drafted this law verified that the predictions from several years ago have held up based on newer data, but it's really not much of a stretch think that they actually did check with the experts. As for airplanes, power plants and othe…
"So those sources are cleaner per gallon of fuel than a gas-powered leaf blower, and they don't exhaust quite as close to living, breathing people."
Per gallon. Lawn equipment is is a tiny fraction compared to these others. Airports tend to be in cities, power plants tend to be close to population centers, most people have a road in front of their house... sounds like those are close to people, output more overall, and are used more frequently than once every week or two.
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Maybe, but there clearly will be less. People are lazy, and aren’t going to go through this much work. See incandescent light bulbs. Most people bought over LED before the ban. You can buy them from China still, but most people don’t. So in the end it wins without doing some kind of crazy enforcement,
Incandescents are engineered to have a short life. Abandoning them is a no brainier. Gas power equipment still has endurance and power that eclipses electric alternatives.
My landscapers work 12 hour days. How would they charge a battery mower 10+ times? It’s fine for a homeowner but not so great for a pro
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They are the primary one. No reason they can't put catalytic converters on. If we really want to be green, then why not require reel mowers?
> No reason they can't put catalytic converters on. The cost of the catalytic converter itself, plus the advanced ECU necessary to make it work properly would make gas-powered lawn mowers more expensive than an electric plus a pile of spare batteries. > If we really want to be green, then why not require reel mowers? Grow up.
Responses like this violate the rules for the site and undermine HN as a place of discussion. I would love to hear a real argument.
"The cost of the catalytic converter itself, plus the advanced ECU necessary to make it work properly would make gas-powered lawn mowers more expensive than an electric plus a pile of spare batteries."
The ECU is a joke, and not a necessary part of using a catalytic converter. You can run a pi zero or audrino as an ECU.
The catalytic converter would be more expensive than not having one, but not that expensive. You might be assuming they would cost the same as one for a car, but they would be drastically scaled down. You can find new catalytic converters for small cars for under $100.
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While I can get on board with restricting 2-stroke engines in most cases (there’s still many situations where there’s no viable substitutes), I’m puzzled how they expect to have gas-powered generators be zero emission. That seems to defy the laws of physics and chemistry. By definition, people use generators when there’s no source of mains power, whether that’s during a power outage or needing to use electric devices…
Propane generators will also be banned in this bill.