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China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

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Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#81

Post by int_19h »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #57
viktorcode wrote: post #23

Nobody seems to notice that it should not matter at all how accurate exactly the information Wikimedia contains, because it has no relation to the role they can fulfil at WIPO. China blocks the application, citing irrelevant info. Then other countries dismiss those irrelevant accusations as false. It seems the future of WIPO is to become irrelevant UN body.

China does this across the whole UN. You can’t bring your high school club to visit without appeasing the censors, who will check that the school and its clubs have never blogged mentioning Taiwan as anything other than a “province of China.” China is on the security council so this will never change. The UN will implode first. https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/china-makes-sure-everyone-w...

To be fair, this is just one of the many examples of UNSC being broken by design. In a similar vein, US tends to use its veto indiscriminately to cover up for Israel, and Russia does the same for its client states and allies.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#82

Post by rsj_hn »

pessimizer wrote: post #74
rsj_hn wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have North and South Korea when the communist revolution succeeded in the north but not the South. In the U.S., West Virginia split off from Virginia when most of Virginia joined the confederacy but a part didn't. Civil Wars, partial rebellions, partial revolutions, are one the mechanisms of state formation.

We have North and South Korea because of a US invasion, the massacre of tens of thousands of people in the South with any sort of left/social-liberal sympathies, and a fully fascist government propped up by the US that lasted until the 80s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilminism It's nothing to respect. The US is something to respect, because it's got a lot more economic and military power than poor backwards NK. Thr…

> We have North and South Korea because of a US invasion

No, this is demonstrably false. Korea was annexed by Japan in 1910. After the war, Korea was partitioned -- much like Europe -- with North Korea occupied by the Soviet Union and South Korea occupied by the US along the 38th parallel in 1945. Except the nature of the respective military presence was very different. The Soviet Union and China brought in large quanties of military equipment and troops, while actively supporting communist guerrillas in the South (but there were never more than ~5000 such guerillas). North Korea invaded the South on June 25, 1950 with ~200K troops and 75K PLA troops of Korean ethnicity, whereas the US had 2-300 troops in all of South Korea. The North attacked with 280 tanks furnished by the Soviet Union, whereas South Korea had no tanks, as the US refused to provide them with any prior to 1950. The North had 110 attack bombers, and 150 Yak fighter planes provided by the USSR. The US did not give any aircraft to the South, and there were only 22 aircraft in the South. The US had basically a token military presence in South Korea as it was not interested in either invading the North or building military bases in the South. You can read more at

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War#Prelude_to_war_(195...

To call this a "US invasion" is absurd. Moreover, somehow trying to make this about the boogeyman of "fighting fascism" or even "civil unions" is bizarre -- what is the state of civil unions in North Korea or China? What is the state of freedom of expression? Or freedom of religion? If you are going to be using words like "fascist", then they are much better applied to North Korea or China than to South Korea or Taiwan.

Please don't spread this type of disinfo on public forums.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#84

Post by mr_toad »

1ris wrote: post #24
beaunative wrote: post #15

I don't think China has grudge against Wikimedia specifically, the official policy of theirs has always been that if you recognize Taiwan, you are no friend of them. I don't think the Chinese delegate there cares about free knowledge, further it's their job literally to say no to Taiwan recongition anywhere on earth. So why should we be surprised that China does this when the United States federal government don't ca…

First of all, no private organisation can "recognize" a state. That is a privilege for states. Private organisations can only boycott (non-)states by not doing any business with said (non-)citizens. Why in the world Wikimedia do that, and how? Second, this policy by china is the problem. Not the lack of obedience by the rest of the world.

> First of all, no private organisation can "recognize" a state.

That’s not how the CCP sees it. They have threatened hotel chains and airlines that referred to Taiwan as a country.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#85

Post by ethbr0 »

baybal2 wrote: post #76
chunghuaming wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Watching James Bond this weekend made me sad. No mention of China at all, as the cause of many geopolitical crisis around the world, as well as the source of atrocious acts against muslims (go check out cnn's china whistlerblower interview recently that detailed the hanging of uighurs and raping of them). If you want a super evil villain, look no further than Xi Jing ping and the CCP, who has threatened literally mos…

The West really, really wants to shut its eyes on China very tight. We need to deny the West this comfort. That's a paradoxal reaction. It's like somebody being raped tries to cover her face to not to see her rapist. Not seeing a rapist doesn't change the ground reality of you still being raped. The correct action is not to use hands to cover your face, but to punch back the assailant.

Facts make a better argument than histrionics.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#86

Post by int_19h »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #36
1ris wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all, no private organisation can "recognize" a state. That is a privilege for states. Private organisations can only boycott (non-)states by not doing any business with said (non-)citizens. Why in the world Wikimedia do that, and how? Second, this policy by china is the problem. Not the lack of obedience by the rest of the world.

I have 0 clue why in the 1970s we didn't make it a de jure situation, like with Korea, like with Vietnam. China wanted the UN seat, right? Would they really turn that down because the US insisted on saying some shit about Taiwan? When they were kinda broke and caught between us and Soviets? Did the KMT really not want to give up "Republic of China", even if it meant being relegated to non-country status? Does it even…

The vote to replace Taiwan with PRC in UN was in the General Assembly. US did not have enough votes there to force PRC to do anything, nor did it have the power to veto.

US did attempt to block it by claiming that it is an "important question" under Article 18 of the UN Charter - specifically, that it counted as expulsion of a member. This was rejected on the basis that no member was actually expelled: China was a member before the vote, and it remained a member after the vote, the only difference being which government's delegation represented it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembl...

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#87

Post by int_19h »

pessimizer wrote: post #74
rsj_hn wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have North and South Korea when the communist revolution succeeded in the north but not the South. In the U.S., West Virginia split off from Virginia when most of Virginia joined the confederacy but a part didn't. Civil Wars, partial rebellions, partial revolutions, are one the mechanisms of state formation.

We have North and South Korea because of a US invasion, the massacre of tens of thousands of people in the South with any sort of left/social-liberal sympathies, and a fully fascist government propped up by the US that lasted until the 80s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilminism It's nothing to respect. The US is something to respect, because it's got a lot more economic and military power than poor backwards NK. Thr…

Korean War was a military operation authorized by UN. Calling it a "US invasion" is rather a stretch, especially considering that it was the North's invasion of the South that triggered the war.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#88

Post by ethbr0 »

int_19h wrote: post #81
fennecfoxen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China does this across the whole UN. You can’t bring your high school club to visit without appeasing the censors, who will check that the school and its clubs have never blogged mentioning Taiwan as anything other than a “province of China.” China is on the security council so this will never change. The UN will implode first. https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/china-makes-sure-everyone-w...

To be fair, this is just one of the many examples of UNSC being broken by design. In a similar vein, US tends to use its veto indiscriminately to cover up for Israel, and Russia does the same for its client states and allies.

That's the entire point of the Security Council -- to allow states with the most powerful militaries and nuclear weapons to exert greater influence.

To create another system would be to risk irrelevance due to the mismatch between actual military power and UN power.

It sucks when it leads to states using that power, but the alternative is more wars and potentially nuclear weapons use.

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#89

Post by voldacar »

fouric wrote: post #22
tuberelay wrote: post #4

China corrupts any global organization it touches.

I can think of the WHO, John Cena's Twitter apology, Blizzard, the NBA, and Apple, but what else is there?

Superhero movies, and hollywood in general

Re: China blocks Wikimedia from entering World Intellectual Property Organization

#90

Post by int_19h »

dirtyid wrote: post #43
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a hard time coping with pacing non-white super power One, regional power. Emerging superpower. But still lacking long-distance force projection capability. Two, share of global population doesn’t give one the right to invade and subjugate a free population. Taiwan isn’t China. It doesn’t want to be China. The world has a definite interest in protecting it.

The US is next level global hyper-power. PRC only seeks to be regional hegemony / super power, i.e. pacing power. PLAN has enough ships and replenishment fleet to project to Djibouti/ME oil without issue for years. Not enough to go toe-to-toe with USN yet, but enough for anything else. Training is just focused on securing SCS right now. Within context post WW2 westphalia sovereignty construct PRC has right to finish…

> Interests of 1.4B PRC outweighs 24m on TW.

If Russia decides to annex e.g. Ukraine in its entirety tomorrow, do the interests of 146 million Russians outweigh the interests of 41 million Ukrainians? It doesn't really work that way.

(Not to mention that the government of PRC is not exactly representative.)

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