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Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

reuters.com

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Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#321

Post by KozmoNau7 »

bserge wrote: post #129
__blockcipher__ wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just out of curiosity, did you get COVID first and then decided to get the vaccine later on? Or was it the other way around? I'm guessing the former - I've had friends who had COVID and their doctors still advised them to get the vaccine - and find it quite troubling if so. We've known for so long now how robust natural immunity is - and before we "knew for sure" any sane person's priors would still assume natural im…

Because the officials are fucking cretinoids who can't understand it. I had Covid, had immunity, and no one gave a flying fuck. I had to follow the same procedures as everyone else. PCR tests up the ass, waste of money, travel blocks. Half a year later I got the J&J vaccine and had a mild fever for a day (proving my previous infection worked for immunity, just imo). Yet I still wear a fucking mask and shit. At least…

I didn't have COVID, and I also only had a day or so of fever after my J&J shot in June. My girlfriend had a similarly mild reaction, and we've both been tested regularly for various reasons, we're pretty certain that we haven't been infected.

I just got my recommended booster shot of Moderna yesterday, now I'm waiting to see how hard that will hit me.

There are no certainties, but I know that here you would also been considered immune if you had previously been infected, but not yet vaccinated.

Bad public policy unfortunately exists, same with the thing about not accepting the J&J vaccine as valid. It works about as well as the mRNA vaccines against hospitalizations and death, but with somewhat less efficacy against base infection, and of course a slightly larger risk of complications. That doesn't make it a bad vaccine, so countries not accepting it is completely insane.

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#322

Post by post_from_work »

cletus wrote: post #204
iratewizard wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USDA and AHA recommended cutting out saturated fat for decades and eating 9-13 daily servings of bread and grain. The authorities you say all should blindly follow are grossly incompetent and shown to be wrong time and time again. How long has the medical field been failing with its reproducibility crisis? How many deaths per year are attributed to malpractice in the US? If you want to listen to a bunch of well m…

USDA/AHA > Tucker Carlson (who is vaccinated BTW) > If you want to listen to a bunch of well meaning morons ... Oh the irony. The sad reality is that anti-vaxxers are highly susceptible to being manipulated and that is actively happening by people who are completely hyprocritically doing so for their own personal gain. Every living president (including Trump) and governor is vaccinated. All but 3 Senators are vaccina…

>>>Yet they're happy to play into irrational fears for their own empowerment and enrichment.

Oh you are quite correct about that. Just like last year's vaccine skeptics are today's vaccine authoritarians:

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/07/18/im-not-taking-it-joe...

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#323

Post by mns »

__blockcipher__ wrote: post #89
nicoburns wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a young male who got myocarditis from both covid and the vaccine, the other thing that's worth knowing that I wish I'd known earlier: if you do get it, then the best thing to do to prevent long-term damage is to avoid exercise completely (potentially for 6 months to a year, or until you've been cleared by a doctor).

Just out of curiosity, did you get COVID first and then decided to get the vaccine later on? Or was it the other way around? I'm guessing the former - I've had friends who had COVID and their doctors still advised them to get the vaccine - and find it quite troubling if so. We've known for so long now how robust natural immunity is - and before we "knew for sure" any sane person's priors would still assume natural im…

A friend had COVID, positive by PCR result, loss of taste and all of that, at the beginning of the year. Mild case anyhow, she went to her doctor for a check-up 2-3 months later to make sure everything is fine and was asked afterwards if she is planning to go to get the vaccine, when she said no, at least not anytime soon, rollout was still in the early phases in our country, she got an absolutely insane scolding about how she doesn't care about others and is anti vaccines, and all this from a medical professional. Officially it wasn't even recommended to get it if you are in the first 6 months after recovery. She was quite shocked and dropped the doctor after that.

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#324

Post by blub »

vkou wrote: post #257
RustyRussell wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide data? Here's the weekly Ontario report on vaccine side effects: at the end is the myocarditis/pericarditis breakdown: https://www.publichealthontario.ca/en/health-topics/immuniza...

> Among patients with COVID-19, the risk for myocarditis was higher among males (0.187%) than among females (0.109%) and was highest among adults aged ≥75 years (0.238%), 65–74 years (0.186%), and 50–64 years (0.155%) and among children aged > In adjusted analyses, patients with COVID-19 had, on average, 15.7 (95% CI = 14.1–17.2) times the risk for myocarditis compared with patients without COVID-19; Okay, so it's 'j…

The decision depends on country, pandemic course, mitigations in place and personal risk. Making general claims regarding vaccination is spreading misinformation.

Now you've already been caught making false claims once, the decent thing to do would be to stop being so cocksure and apologize, not dig in.

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#325

Post by tinus_hn »

lightsighter wrote: post #311
tinus_hn wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vaccinated people can still get infected and transmit the virus to others, with or without mutations. The idea that vaccinated people are ‘safe to be around’ is an outdated fantasy.

I never said it stopped all transmission, but it will stop a large fraction of it. We're playing games of probability. Anybody that deals in absolutes is living in a fantasy world.

> stop transmission

> cut edges

How are these not absolutes?

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#326

Post by bserge »

KozmoNau7 wrote: post #321
bserge wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the officials are fucking cretinoids who can't understand it. I had Covid, had immunity, and no one gave a flying fuck. I had to follow the same procedures as everyone else. PCR tests up the ass, waste of money, travel blocks. Half a year later I got the J&J vaccine and had a mild fever for a day (proving my previous infection worked for immunity, just imo). Yet I still wear a fucking mask and shit. At least…

I didn't have COVID, and I also only had a day or so of fever after my J&J shot in June. My girlfriend had a similarly mild reaction, and we've both been tested regularly for various reasons, we're pretty certain that we haven't been infected. I just got my recommended booster shot of Moderna yesterday, now I'm waiting to see how hard that will hit me. There are no certainties, but I know that here you would also bee…

Good to know. I was basing my opinion on the fact that the actual infection (confirmed via PCR) had me very fatigued for a week, with a fever for about half of it. And online reports for J&J showed several days of response effects.

I could've opted for Pfizer, but the wait time for it to arrive and to get the full two doses was too long. J&J is one shot, and some say it works better than "older" vaccines.

I did get into the country that didn't have it on their list to be fair. They probably added it later, AZ was on there.

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#327

Post by TulliusCicero »

mythrwy wrote: post #196
TulliusCicero wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is it "factual" Biden didn't win through voter fraud? Yes. > How exactly did you determine this? By waiting for all the people who did assert voter fraud to present their hard evidence in court. There wasn't any. It's like asking whether it's "factual" that Obama is a human man instead of a secret lizard person wearing an advanced nanotech disguise. I can't affirmatively prove the non-existence of something, but th…

You are claiming an article of faith as fact. It isn't. You can assert probabilities but you can't prove a negative. Appeal to ridicule doesn't change that.

That's exactly what I'm saying. I can't prove a negative -- the burden of proof is on the other party.

By your reasoning, being unable to prove a negative means that, outside of maybe math, facts don't really exist. I can't prove that WW2 wasn't an elaborate hoax, I can't prove that Texas is a real state, I can't prove that babies aren't brought around by very stealthy storks.

The point is, you already accept WW2 as factual -- or you certainly wouldn't object to someone presenting it as such on an internet forum -- despite it possibly being a shared worldwide hallucination, so you're not even being internally consistent.

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#328

Post by [deleted] »

daveguy wrote: post #297
twofornone wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are at least three reasons that an injection is not the same. 1. The sudden viral load is orders of magnitude larger than typical exposure and given the complexity of the immune system, may produce a different response. Also recall that unlike traditional vaccines this mRNA hijacks your cellular machinery to produce an inflammatory protein - so comparing it to past vaccines in this respect is invalid. 2. Again…

> hijacks your cellular machinery No. It doesn't. This is completely ignorant misinformation. Your molecular machinery for creating proteins are doing so constantly. Introducing a bit of code that produces a protein that looks like the virus is in no way "hijacking" your molecular machinery. Your machinery happily chugs along with every other of the 10s of thousands of other proteins being produced at the same time.…

[deleted]

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#329

Post by pas »

nemothekid wrote: post #115
gorwell wrote: post #59

A lot of comments here asking for specific numbers and making comparisons to other risks. That's exactly how one should be looking at this. What I don't understand is why people don't apply this same critical thought process to the risks of Covid? For example, do you know what the risk of hospitalization from Covid is when unvaccinated? If you said >50%, you would be in good company. It's the most common answer. But…

From a public health point of view, deciding whether you should take the vaccine or not is an undoubtedly selfish and short-sighted way to calculate risks. It assumes that hospitalization carries no second-order risks which simply is not the case. For any given area, the question that must be asked is if a COVID outbreak were to occur does that given area have the health resources to manage an outbreak. <1% risk is m…

Plus hospital acquired infections love overcrowded hospitals! and if people think "oh man, long covid really sucks", I can't wait for them to pontificate about "short sepsis MRSA sucks" /s

Re: Finland joins Sweden and Denmark in limiting Moderna Covid-19 vaccine

#330

Post by bserge »

jhgb wrote: post #296
bserge wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume that's compared to normal figures (which are what, btw?). Because if normal figures showed 145 cases of myocarditis out of 177M people, that would be embarrassing as fuck.

Apparently there's like two millions of cases of myocarditis globally, so on average you'd probably expect tens of thousands of cases among 177M people. In what way would 145 cases be embarrassing for "normal figures"? I'd expect that a medical miracle would be praised at that point.

It would be embarrassing (or should be) if the number stayed the same if Covid didn't exist. Meaning the correlation isn't there.
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