Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions • Hacker News Board

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#281

Post by lotsofpulp » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

hnlmorg wrote: post #258

Nextgrid wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "guy in a bathrobe" is still the lead and has the final say. Is he compensated anywhere near what Mozilla's CEO is? In fact is the total comp of all the people significantly involved in Linux kernel development anywhere near the total comp of Mozilla's C-suite? I doubt it.

You're now making a tangential argument about whether people are being paid their worth and frankly that's never been the case. Most of us developers, devops and sysadmins are paid an obscene wage compared to many critical services like nursing. Is it fair? Probably not. But that doesn't have any baring on the complexity of Linux vs Firefox.

Prices are determined by supply and demand, so there is no merit in claiming a person writing software has an obscene earnings compared to a nurse. Not to mention that you can get into all kinds of nonsense like “the team of software developers made something that saved millions of man hours enabling nurses to help many more patients”. But that is neither here nor there.

However, you can compare the people in the same business, such as those writing software for operating systems and web browsers and compare the cost and productivity in both.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#282

Post by dageshi » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

Jenk wrote: post #122

dkdbejwi383 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can't we have one piece of good software that doesn't try to shove "relevant" "suggestions" from "trusted" "partners" down our throats? If you pay for it, yeah. But you can't have that and have the software be £free to use

Many people would pay for firefox. I don't know if it's enough people to offset what advertisers are willing to pay, nor if adding that would dissuade too many users but it'd be nice to have the option to pay so we can support the development of the browser directly, and avoid adverts. Donating to the foundation feels a bit like donating to the WWF because I want to help a specific Panda I met at the zoo.

Many people would pay for firefox so long as it supports their pet features and they all have their own pet features. And it would still be less than they'd get from advertising.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#283

Post by krageon » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

Adrig wrote: post #34

Meh, the feature is easily deactivable, the settings are clear and extensive. As far as ads go, it's one of the best implementations. Firefox still has no alternative in the privacy / user-centric space (don't mention Brave, I'm gonna get mad). Mozilla has done a lot for the web, I can give them some slack for exploring different revenue models. Still, I'm going to keep on eye for this kind of practices in the future…

> easily deactivable

Such a thing should not exist in the first place. It is predatory and wrong.

> Firefox still has no alternative in the privacy / user-centric space

It is no longer in that space, because it contains advertising tech now.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#284

Post by hnarn » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

The single largest benefits of Firefox to me is that it's privacy friendly and open source. If the first thing you have to do when installing this "privacy friendly" software is to disable a bunch of privacy invading features, what's the reason to not just use a fork instead? And if you're going to use a fork, why not just use open-source Chromium instead? What arguments are left to the benefit of Firefox, fighting web standard hegemony by picking one privacy-hostile option over the other?

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#285

Post by krageon » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:09 AM UTC

dgb23 wrote: post #169

I stuck with Firefox when Chrome stormed the market with a faster browser. Mozilla has had a highly respected name. I'm not so convinced about that anymore... For me the core values of the browser are: - free software, open source, as in freedom - independent (mozilla is weak here) - developer friendly, good debugging/dev interface (they are slowly losing here) - keeping up with web standards, letting me play with pr…

Functionally there are only two browsers, and they are both terrible. As such, it has to be no. The options you have are reskins of those two browsers or browsers that miss big features and are therefore a PITA to use (I'm looking at you, Safari).

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#286

Post by krageon » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:10 AM UTC

worble wrote: post #86

vitro wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, same with Thunderbird. I'd like to donate directly to the development of those, but it is not possible, AFAIK.

You can donate directly to Thunderbird https://give.thunderbird.net/ From the FAQ: >How will my gift be used? >Thunderbird is the leading open source cross-platform email and calendaring client, free for business and personal use. Your gift will help ensure it stays that way, and will support future development.

That doesn't say that it goes directly to thunderbird at all.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#287

Post by krageon » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:11 AM UTC

paulintrognon wrote: post #272

They do that because they need money. Why can't they just ask for money? Can't we just have a healthier business model: you want a good product that cost money to develop, just pay for it? It could be a freemium model: users paying for premium features (Sync, VPN, ...) support the company, for example.

> they need money

They don't need money, they have an almost unthinkable amount of capital. If they'd kill all their stupid side stuff and fire that weird shark at the top they could develop this browser for a long time. In fact, instead of firing the servo team that is what they should have done instead of this alienating and frankly extremely problematic policy shift.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#288

Post by krono » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:11 AM UTC

morsch wrote: post #141

krono wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neutral FYI: VLC on OSX had unremovable sponsored radio/podcasts in its sidebar last time I used it

Are you sure you weren't using a VLC clone that added this stuff? Because these things exist (e.g. "VLC plus"). They're basically malware, tricking people into downloading what they think is the genuine article.

Yeah I'm sure it was a genuine installation. See this: https://forum.videolan.org/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=99040

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#289

Post by krageon » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:11 AM UTC

mhaberl wrote: post #7

> You might notice a message inviting you to enable these new suggestions the next time you install or update Firefox. So its opt-in, what is the issue?

The issue is that this feature exists at all. Ads and tracking are the cause of 90% of what is wrong with the current internet.

Re: Mozilla to put ads in Firefox address bar suggestions

#290

Post by worrycue » Thu, Oct 07, 2021, 10:11 AM UTC

squarefoot wrote: post #54

As a Firefox user, and after having donated to the foundation, I was outraged by reading this. https://calpaterson.com/mozilla.html If they need money, they already know where to find it without polluting the experience with ads.

Can’t help but feel the golden goose is being gutted. The massive downsizing was the 1st step. Ads is part 2.

The c-suite is paid millions all while their market share (their primary leverage and source of influence) slips towards nothing.

Google has won without lifting a finger - they just let their opponent blunder into defeat.