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Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

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Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#691

Post by mountainb »

josephg wrote: post #585
munk-a wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s bad for society to codify too much behaviour in law. The issue with over-codification is one of the complexity in the laws that result - not that a large number of prohibitions is actually damaging to society. If too many laws exist then enforcement becomes intractable, arbitrary and unjust - but if enforcement could be sanely and fairly dealt out then there are lots of things that we'd appreciate being laws -…

> if enforcement could be sanely and fairly dealt out then there are lots of things that we'd appreciate being laws I'm hearing a hypothesis - that if enforcement was cheap and easy, we could make a better legal system (and a better society) by regulating far more human interaction. Presumably we'd have AI systems monitoring everyone at all times, and issuing automatic fines if you snipe someone's parking spot. "Citi…

Facebook is governed by many laws and it flouts a lot of them. For example, they screw up the DMCA process continuously in a way that by statute should make them lose their safe harbor (no "Section 230 reform" needed). Just by sheer volume of mistakes related to processing DMCA notices and counternotices they should lose their safe harbor protection. Even though surely many of the mistakes are unintentional human error, it doesn't actually matter that much according to the wording of the law.

They allow the hosting of a lot of egregious criminal activity, including maintaining uncountable numbers of what the law would define as notorious marketplaces for criminal activity. The trouble is lack of enforcement. You cannot fix a lack of enforcement with new laws that will just go unenforced.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#692

Post by parineum »

dandotway wrote: post #625
mrep wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For everyone responding that smokers cost the government money, it is actually the opposite in that they save the government money because on average they die sooner. From the manning study: "In this analysis, the federal government saves about $29 billion per year in net health and retirement costs (accounting for effects on tax payments). These include a saving in retirement (largely social security benefits) of ab…

Presumably COVID also saves the government money, then? It mostly kills the old who have already paid into the tax system their whole working lives and are now drawing from it. And it mostly kills the chronically ill who need more tax support than they contribute. It seems terribly cold and callous to look at it this way though, e.g. when a son is holding his mom's hand in the hospital who is dying of lung cancer, to…

> Presumably COVID also saves the government money, then?

It most certainly does. The retort your parent made is for those who make the argument that a tax is necessary because X (smoking, in this case) costs the country economically.

If you want to make the purely _economic_ argument, it's a benefit to the bottom line.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#693

Post by parineum »

ethbr0 wrote: post #643
parineum wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do we solve the problem of people accidentally killing someone with their car?

We require driving licenses, age restrict operation of vehicles, require vehicles to operate within parameters (speed limits, gross vehicle weights) and according to standards (traffic signals and markings), and prohibit operation while under the influence of decision or reaction-impairing substances. Because these are all statistical precursors to accidentally killing someone with a car.

Texting while driving, while illegal (everywhere by now, I assume), causes more accidents than driving under the influence (both in total numbers and, apparently, per capita). Should we tax text messages?

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#694

Post by raxxorrax »

christkv wrote: post #186
hunterb123 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To clarify, can you specify exactly what law you would like made? What do you want to be done exactly ? I would rather take the stance of feed algorithms and moderation logs be PUBLICLY available. Transparency instead of censorship.

How about an age limit. You have to be 18 or above.

People seem to dislike this suggestion, but while I believe it is unrealistic to check for age on the internet, this idea has some merit.

Platforms that harbor minors and adults together will have to have different rules than platforms just for adults. But you also cannot make everything fit for kids. Government would actually try to do just that since ensuring safety here is their mandate. So a solution must be found. Normally minors should be supervised, but that is not trivial and you don't want constant surveillance.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#695

Post by hulitu »

listless wrote: post #510
taf2 wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My Mom said it to me with simpler terms when i was little... "we only have laws because of the assholes"

Wait - does that mean it’s the assholes who make the laws or are they the ones we create laws for? Or does it work both ways?! Your moms super profound.

Both ways.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#696

Post by SavantIdiot »

gruez wrote: post #92
SavantIdiot wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can't moderate your platform, you shouldn't have a platform. This "Boo hoo we can't moderate ... " wipes tears with billions of dollars ... is deadly comedy, yet lots of people fall for it.

> If you can't moderate your platform, you shouldn't have a platform. what counts as "moderate"? only removing illegal material? removing fake news as well? maybe remove questionable news as well, as long as it's towards the "greater good"?

Yep.

Next.

After 4 years of non stop lies from the Trump machine, Q and AntiVaxx, you can fuck right off.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#697

Post by munificent »

eightysixfour wrote: post #561
munificent wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simply disallowing corporations to reach the scale of Facebook/ConAgra/Amazon/WalMart would solve many many problems. These companies do awful things because: 1. They have few viable alternatives so ethical consumers end up choosing them when they might not otherwise. 2. They have enough money that it is profitable to do bad things and pay for the damage control. 3. They have enough power to defeat regulation and gov…

So for a digital platform you are suggesting that after X users they allow no more sign-ups until someone churns out?

I don't think number of users is the metric that really matters. I care a lot more about market cap because money is what gives corporations greater leverage to do bad stuff.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#698

Post by kmlx »

015a wrote: post #635
mr_toad wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chemical dependency is a real thing with serious medical effects. Severe cases of withdrawal can actually be fatal.

Social media dependency is a real thing, with serious medical side effects, which can include Depression, which in severe cases can actually be fatal. But, you know, prescription medicine dependence, its different, right? Right. Its gotta be different. And the reason its different is because... fewer people use social media? No. Fewer people suffer from mental health issues? Definitely not. Fewer people have overtly…

> Social media dependency is a real thing, with serious medical side effects

citation? or source? i'm asking since it's the first time i'm seeing this idea.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#699

Post by q1w2 »

avisser wrote: post #87
q1w2 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seriously doubt shareholders agree with her angle. > her best chance is to hope that Facebook will simply try to minimize the legal issue to avoid making her into too much of a martyr I suspect the opposite. They will attempt to make an example of her to dissuade subsequent whistleblowers. Social media has a short attention span and forgets its "martyrs" within days.

Doesn't the fact that Facebook shares dropped %5+ yesterday give some credence to that argument? It's obviously more complex than that, but selling is how shareholders would express their agreement.

The entire tech sector sold off for unrelated reasons.

Also, the most concrete expression of shareholder opinions is at the shareholder meetings - which never even mention these subjects.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#700

Post by defaultprimate »

woeirua wrote: post #77

I think a lot of people are choosing to ignore that a lot of companies have done things in the past that were not illegal at the time of action. However, those actions were later decided to be made illegal because the behavior was deemed to be antithetical to our values. For example, Standard Oil did not break any laws in its ruthless consolidation of the nascent oil industry. In fact, it exploited the law to allow i…

Standard Oil had gone from >90% market share to < 60% by the time any legislation related to it was enacted. The legislation hurt their competitors, who were catching up using similar business strategies, more than SO.
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