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Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

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Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#201

Post by OldHand2018 »

shmatt wrote: post #36

There is something that doesn't sit right with me about the whistleblower. Yes, she is a data scientist which gives her many many extra points. But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. Her actual scope of the what was going on in FB as a huge org, as she's trying to comment on (the "I want to fix FB" quotes from 60 minutes) Everyone I know who works in FAANG, FB specifically, and PMs even more specifically, really hav…

Let me ask you something: How much of the "bigger picture" did Snowden have?

Because, you know, one person is male and the other is female, and I'd really like to believe that gender has nothing to do with it.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#202

Post by jorblumesea »

ozzythecat wrote: post #141

I don’t personally use FB and don’t have a very favorable view of their products. I would, however, like to see the same level scrutiny applied to the general American media, especially the news media. FB has come in and started eating their lunch. There’s a deeper problem here, and it feels more like the powers that he want to take down FB. I’m not denying any allegation made against FB, but why is it that Fox News,…

FB is much worse because there's no sense of moderation.

In mainstream media, there's someone who vets content, fact checkers etc. You can disagree on whether you think Tucker Carlson is "factual" but effort goes into not running afoul of legal rules and fear of being sued. Scripts are written, it's edited, etc.

With social media, it's just straight up lies. Not even "a little bias" but just straight up garbage. They hide behind "free speech" and "light moderation" but the reality is that there's no rules like traditional media have to take into account.

> when they’ve been damaging America for much longer than FB has existed

Has modern mainstream media been implicated in major events like the Jan 6th insurrection?

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#203

Post by joshmlewis »

avisser wrote: post #87
q1w2 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seriously doubt shareholders agree with her angle. > her best chance is to hope that Facebook will simply try to minimize the legal issue to avoid making her into too much of a martyr I suspect the opposite. They will attempt to make an example of her to dissuade subsequent whistleblowers. Social media has a short attention span and forgets its "martyrs" within days.

Doesn't the fact that Facebook shares dropped %5+ yesterday give some credence to that argument? It's obviously more complex than that, but selling is how shareholders would express their agreement.

But the stock has bounced back today. A lot of tech stocks dipped yesterday.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#205

Post by intended »

shmatt wrote: post #36

There is something that doesn't sit right with me about the whistleblower. Yes, she is a data scientist which gives her many many extra points. But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. Her actual scope of the what was going on in FB as a huge org, as she's trying to comment on (the "I want to fix FB" quotes from 60 minutes) Everyone I know who works in FAANG, FB specifically, and PMs even more specifically, really hav…

Are there any specific parts of her testimony that you disagree with?

From what I have seen, everything she has said tracks correctly, and does not go outside her realm of knowledge.

She has limited her focus very clearly, for example on FB prioritizing reshares vs a known increased risk of violence.

So she is in perfect position say that FB has chosen to prioritize growth over user safety.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#206

Post by asdff »

mckirk wrote: post #182
asdff wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There should be some laws about using addictive patterns imo. I'm sure that's fine and profitable and coca cola would continue to like putting cocaine into their drinks to make their customers want it all the more, but we have laws preventing that behavior in the meatspace and therefore we can have laws preventing this sort of evil behavior with technology companies too. Tie it into website accessibility laws that ar…

The gaming industry would like to have a word... In a sense, companies are right now incentived to develop the most effective 'digital crack', because anything that hijacks the reward pathway of the brain more effectively leads to more profit. It'll be quite interesting to see how the public discourse around this will progress, since digital entertainment isn't as easy to publicly mark as 'bad' as drugs were. On the…

Digital crack is a perfect way to describe this. I'm sure someone clever enough can write some great legislation for this. The issue is that so many industries are beholden to relying on digital crack. You might get one senator who wants this, then 99 others who are getting flooded with calls from every major employer in their district telling them to vote no. I wish we had stronger government that wasn't so susceptible to having anything good for the public exploited to make a few people very wealthy. Then again we've never had this sort of public first government in the history of our nation, its sort of always been like this out of design whenever I learn more about our history.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#207

Post by IshKebab »

nradov wrote: post #147

The title here doesn't match the article headline. The documents make Facebook look bad but so far I haven't seen anything incriminating , in the sense of violating a US Federal criminal statute. Are there credible allegations of something like securities fraud or wire fraud here? Note that there is no generally no law against disseminating incorrect or "harmful" information.

Yeah this appears to just be some embarrassing things but nothing outright illegal or really even surprising. What company doesn't have embarrassing secrets they'd rather not be leaked? None that I've worked at anyway, and none of those were evil.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#208

Post by shmatt »

kentonv wrote: post #117
shmatt wrote: post #36

There is something that doesn't sit right with me about the whistleblower. Yes, she is a data scientist which gives her many many extra points. But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. Her actual scope of the what was going on in FB as a huge org, as she's trying to comment on (the "I want to fix FB" quotes from 60 minutes) Everyone I know who works in FAANG, FB specifically, and PMs even more specifically, really hav…

> But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. More like 15 years. I've known Frances since 2009 when she was a PM at Google, where she worked on a few products including Google+. She also spent several years an Pinterest which, while not technically a FAANG, is certainly a major social network that does lots of algorithmic ranking. She is definitely an expert in the topics she is testifying about.

my point was, people who work for 2 years at FAANG, in 1 company, far from understand the complete scope. I did not mean she was 2 years into her career

It can take 6 months to just fully understand what a 7 person team does

After 2 years at Facebook, does she really understand the full strategy 4 levels above her? Her leak is super important, but she doesn't have all the answers the media is claiming she does

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#209

Post by robbrown451 »

warent wrote: post #59
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Her bigger risk is probably the employment angle. Hard to picture hiring this person except if you're 100% certain your company's behavior aligns with her morals, and you can't find anyone else. Even for people who generally agree with her view on Facebook employing her presents a pretty serious known risk at this point.

I'm having doubts, seems that most startups and small/medium businesses will not care at all. Have you seen the market? Engineers are ridiculously scarce. Most hiring managers and execs will just say something like "Great, we're too small and don't do anything like Facebook. Just keep her in the code and restrict access to Google Drive"

I can't see her being a coder going forward. She is globally famous for taking a stand (from a very technically informed perspective) on policy issues. A smart company would hire her to be in a very public facing position, that will reflect upon themselves positively.

Obviously, a company that has a huge amount to hide isn't going to want to hire her.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#210

Post by afavour »

jasondigitized wrote: post #149
afavour wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh come on, they’re not comparable. If you turn on CNN or Fox News right now I know exactly what you’ll see. Because it’s exactly what I’d see if did the same. What’s on your Facebook feed right now? No clue. How are different types of content weighted? No way of knowing. Facebook holds a lot more secrets than any traditional media company about what they’re showing their users. Leaks from FB are much more valuable.

What will you see? 24-7, Emotionally charged "Breaking News" which is simply a different fruit from the same horrible tree. CNN and Fox News are just using different methods based on the data they have available which comes from focus groups, Nielsen, and a whole cottage industry that most people are unaware of.

> What will you see? 24-7, Emotionally charged "Breaking News" which is simply a different fruit from the same horrible tree.

Right, but we know what they are showing people. We have no idea what Facebook is showing people. There's no equivalence there. Yes, both are bad, but in the context of these leaks equating Facebook to CNN is delusional deflection.

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