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Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

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Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#41

Post by api »

tinus_hn wrote: post #19
ekianjo wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is stopping infections and deaths? The vaccine. Vaccinated people still get and spread infections - They simply dont get much symptoms from it. This kind of comment is exactly why people don't understand what the "vaccines" actually do.

You need to believe vaccines stop infections to be able to blame the unvaccinated for the continuation of the pandemic.

I don’t blame the unvaccinated for the continuation of the pandemic, but they can clearly be blamed for overflowing hospitals. The vaccine sharply reduces severe symptoms and long term symptoms.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#42

Post by vcoelho »

ekianjo wrote: post #17

Where's the data in this article? No graphs, no publication? If I want a full conclusion I'd like to see more than a journalist's take on this.

I guess that's the point? No solid evidence of ivermectin efficacy existed before the government launched a national-wide web form that prescribed it for anyone with Covid symptoms, or before major health insurers started testing on patients without their families consent, or people rushing to the pharmacy and clearing out their stock of those medicine.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#43

Post by smorgusofborg »

tinus_hn wrote: post #34
smorgusofborg wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mutation in animals typically lower it's viability in humans. So the question is if I have been vaccinated and there aren't enough unvaccinated people to jam hospitals, why do I continue to care about viruses in animal populations that are just like any other virus that might pop up the next time someone licks a bat? If I'm willing to take any sort of vaccine for it when it becomes viable again in humans, then I'm sa…

I don’t know why you continue to care. All I see are people clinging to their precious mask mandates and pushing for vaccine booster shots, with the ‘hospitals are filling up’ and ‘the unvaccinated cause mutations’ excuses. But as has been known from at least a year ago, hospitals are filling up with the vulnerable population so that would leave no reason for vaccine mandates on the not vulnerable population, like yo…

There are breakdown for hospitalized in Switzerland:

https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/vaccination/breakthrough

Switzerland runs with a much higher infection rate and faster economy than Germany because it has many more beds per million. These beds are being occupied by more 20 somethings without than 80 somethings with vaccination.

I'm annoyed by the slowness of things in Switzerland, I'm impacted by the even more absurd slowness of things in Germany. And all of this is from people who voted down pesticide regulations and water regulations so they don't care what ends up in my body.

The west behaving this way on public health while viewing libertarian ideals as justified whenever they are economically good and accidentally hurt people is the kind of insult to morals that I think correlates to western decline.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#44

Post by vcoelho »

jbotz wrote: post #31
oblio wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the angle, though. Cui bono?

It's cheap? No US-based pharma corps are reaping big profits from it? Btw., I live in Brazil, and I went with one of my daughters to see a GP a few days ago because she had symptoms of respiratory illness and was worried it might be Covid (she had had recent contact with peers who afterward tested positive). The physician told her to get a test, and if it were positive (it wasn't) she should take Vitamin C, N-acytilc…

Once everyone starts taking it preemptively for covid, would it still be cheap?

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#45

Post by incrudible »

javagram wrote: post #40
incrudible wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vaccines are not stopping infections. https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10654-021-00808-7

Other studies show the vaccines provide between 40-70% reduction in COVID-19 Delta infections.[0] Looking at your link, it looks like the comparisons they make are purely based on COVID case counts and vaccination percentages. There are other factors that need to be considered: counties with higher vaccination rates in the USA are also likely to have a higher rate of testing, due to the politics of COVID (people who…

There is currently no reduction in infections among double vaccinated people in Israel. Waning protection against infection means that any study giving a single number for reduction is a snapshot of a situation in the past, not a predictor. Perhaps staggered booster administration in 3 month intervals could achieve a constant reduction approaching 90%.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#46

Post by aaron695 »

bXVsbGVy wrote: post #29
aaron695 wrote: post #6

> hoping to stave off COVID-19, but in a few rare cases that move prompted liver failure Ivermectin does not cause liver failure. There is no evidence of this. The Tweet about the one patient does not say the patient is getting a liver transplant, and they are not sure why there was liver issues. It can cause liver injury in a really small amount of cases, which should self correct. (I assume people do not think temp…

Brazilian, here. I didn't know about this tweet. Looking for it, I found an article that interviewed him [1]. The twitter doctor is the president of a respiratory disease association in Sao Paulo. He claims the young lady had a "drug-induced hepatitis" after taking 18mg of IVM daily for a week. "She is very close to need a transplant". The doctor remarks the drug safety, "Ivermectin is a safe drug, it has been used o…

I'm not sure I trust [2] it seems most articles rehash the Estadao article. Are there other sources?

Dr Luiz Carneiro D’Albuquerque from the Estadao article is interviewed here shortly after https://globoplay.globo.com/v/9387212/

Does he confirm what the article says he says, Ivermectin is strongly suspected for transplants? It's hard to tell with translate.

> get ready for: ozone therapy (in the anus), and HQC inhalation.

This is why I love living in the future, thank you for that info. A Visual Guide to Ozone Rectal Insufflation - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bz-ZEOpgTsY (2017) Their website is cool, "check out our refurbished products" and "gift certificates"

Interesting it was tried for HIV as well and ozone in treatments is 100 years old. All bunk. But that's the future, we can order this interesting stuff for at home now, not hidden in university labs.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#47

Post by mmmeff »

oblio wrote: post #25
aaron695 wrote: post #6

> hoping to stave off COVID-19, but in a few rare cases that move prompted liver failure Ivermectin does not cause liver failure. There is no evidence of this. The Tweet about the one patient does not say the patient is getting a liver transplant, and they are not sure why there was liver issues. It can cause liver injury in a really small amount of cases, which should self correct. (I assume people do not think temp…

> It's a very safe drug. That's why is so important. But media lies and vilification of a 3rd world drug I guess are more important. What's the angle, though. Cui bono? Edit: Thanks for the downvote. If you come up with conspiracy theories, you have to explain this, not me. It's step 1 of a conspiracy: Who benefits? How?

Pharma benefits - not just from vaccine profits, but from the new drug they’re currently testing, molnupiravir. Unlike IVM, it’s patentable, though it operates on a similar biomechanism as IVM (protease inhibition). Merck plans to charge thousands per dose once they wrap clinical trials. Fauci is on the record hyping this new drug as well.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#48

Post by tinus_hn »

smorgusofborg wrote: post #43
tinus_hn wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know why you continue to care. All I see are people clinging to their precious mask mandates and pushing for vaccine booster shots, with the ‘hospitals are filling up’ and ‘the unvaccinated cause mutations’ excuses. But as has been known from at least a year ago, hospitals are filling up with the vulnerable population so that would leave no reason for vaccine mandates on the not vulnerable population, like yo…

There are breakdown for hospitalized in Switzerland: https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/vaccination/breakthrough Switzerland runs with a much higher infection rate and faster economy than Germany because it has many more beds per million. These beds are being occupied by more 20 somethings without than 80 somethings with vaccination. I'm annoyed by the slowness of things in Switzerland, I'm impacted by the even more abs…

Cumulative numbers for the entire length of the pandemic:

  Hospitalizations for 0-9: 199
  Hospitalizations for 10-19: 85
  Hospitalizations for 80+: 2142
Breakthrough hospitalizations:

  60-69: 47
  70-79: 73
  80+: 107
I’m not sure what you’re seeing in this data. Perhaps if you pick and choose age groups you can make it look like more young people end up in hospitals than old vaccinated people. But you’d have be really selective.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#49

Post by smorgusofborg »

incrudible wrote: post #36
smorgusofborg wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> …but there are highly vaccinated populations with high infection rates, right? Israel is about the highest examined and it is not high enough to know how a control group of vaccinated verse unvaccinated individuals would fare in a place where any other individual was vaccinated or bellow 12. 95% was in a retail lock down environment. In the current environment I am having hundreds of interactions a week with the un…

The paper also examined individual counties in the US and found no correlation. There have been numerous outbreaks within fully vaccinated groups. You can speculate that these outbreaks would've been even bigger if these groups weren't vaccinated, but ultimately the virus spreads no matter what. The word "stop" to me implies an end to viral spread, not an indeterminate amount of reduction - that's a "slowdown".

> but ultimately the virus spreads no matter what.

No, the virus spreads as a function of what actions you take and society slows based on what actions you take. If no one is dieing or going to hospital you choose economy and cases go up but if you are highly vaccinated then the consequences are not enough to not open up further and you run with higher numbers of known cases.

A correlation study is irrelevant to how effective vaccination is, just as any other intervention might appear ineffective if it allows systems to remove stricter restrictions with higher societal impact or makes people feel safe enough to participate in additional activities.

Some unvaccinated people in my town feel safe enough to do things because more people are safe and are doing them than in a town with no vaccination and more conservative average behavior, that doesn't mean the vaccine didn't work.

Re: Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

#50

Post by oblio »

mmmeff wrote: post #47
oblio wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a very safe drug. That's why is so important. But media lies and vilification of a 3rd world drug I guess are more important. What's the angle, though. Cui bono? Edit: Thanks for the downvote. If you come up with conspiracy theories, you have to explain this, not me. It's step 1 of a conspiracy: Who benefits? How?

Pharma benefits - not just from vaccine profits, but from the new drug they’re currently testing, molnupiravir. Unlike IVM, it’s patentable, though it operates on a similar biomechanism as IVM (protease inhibition). Merck plans to charge thousands per dose once they wrap clinical trials. Fauci is on the record hyping this new drug as well.

And this is a worldwide conspiracy where they're able to buy all the medical bodies across the world, including in countries with conflicting interests, plus the all the world's top physicians?

I don't buy it.

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