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The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

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Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#91

Post by c0m »

woodruffw wrote: post #54
caeril wrote: post #12

Pretty rich, coming out of an organization that assaulted and chased Vincent Canfield out of CCC for . . . . owning trollish domain names. I'm sure the presenter doesn't necessarily share the Congress's values, but it's funny nonetheless.

> Pretty rich, coming out of an organization that assaulted and chased Vincent Canfield out of CCC for . . . . owning trollish domain names. Are you sure it wasn't him being an open and virulent racist[1]? Edit: I should say that I have the dubious distinction of actually haven spoken to vc for several years on IRC. He might have started as a troll, but he's failed in the way that every bad troll fails: by getting hi…

If he's an open and virulent racist you should have better proof than a twitter account. I read all the tweets he made this year. He posts on Gab, posted a clip from an offensively named Danish satire film, and generally seems about as unpleasant as I'd expect for someone who owns the type of domains he owns but he does not seem to be openly racist.

If you're going to label someone as an "open and virulent racist" you should at least have some evidence to support it. It's unwise to make such extraordinary claims without evidence beyond "trust me bro", particularly on an account linked to your real-life identity as this could reasonably be seen as libellous if it's untrue.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#92

Post by jollybean »

imgabe wrote: post #26
Goronmon wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where do you draw the line though? Are we never allow to criticize someone for their opinions or "jokes", regardless of content or context? It's easy to just state "People should be able to make jokes or have a bad day." and while maybe that's true, I don't think we should be able to brush off all behavior by just labeling it a "bad day".

You draw the line at where it has an actual, measurable impact on other people. “Joe Schmoe has an opinion you don’t like” doesn’t impoverish anyone, it doesn’t prevent anyone from getting food or housing or any other need. It’s just a person having an opinion. Going into hysterics over trivial nonsense that ultimately doesn’t matter is not helping anyone. It’s not making the world a better place. Quite the opposite.

I think context, rather than impact is the most important thing.

Private dialogue among friends is just that.

Unless they are actively plotting violence or some kind of action, or making unambiguous bad statements such as 'I hate people of this group' or an admission of a crime, then otherwise, it just shouldn't be news.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#93

Post by everdrive »

InitialLastName wrote: post #18
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

Except that I never had a chance of being on a hollywood blacklist in the first place. I don't even use social media, and it's still possible I could say something off-color somewhere and find myself canceled.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#95

Post by bingohbangoh »

InitialLastName wrote: post #18
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

Poor kids couldn't get a job in Hollywood. Oh the humanity!

What's going on now is being blacklisted by multiple industries. People who get marked as such never work in "normal" companies again and have to move continents to find work.

You are comparing being blacklisted by a group of people to being blacklisted by society at large.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#96

Post by standardUser »

cm2187 wrote: post #82
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

And the worst is kids. If you think you can go off track and say dumb things as an adult, think of the 14yo self. I thank God I was a teenager before the modern internet. There is no forgiveness. The doors of college education can be shut on a whim for a bad joke. Where and when I grew up, your political opinion was irrelevant to your college admission. You didn't have to demonstrate your committment to the polical c…

Still a spectacularly better proposition than most of US history, where admission were far more restrictive. Many Ivy League schools did not admit women until the 1960s and 1970s. Weird how we forget this stuff and somehow pretend we're living in the more restrictive era.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#97

Post by 100011_100001 »

SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #59
wussboy wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the primary reasons I stay off of social media. There is not forgetting, no opportunity to learn and grow and change and develop.

I feel like this is obvious with a major caveat. You and I agree. Don’t use social media and this won’t be a problem. I think the disadvantages outweigh. But… what about when Hackernews or Reddit or Discord whatever formerly anonymous some-degree-of-social-network is made not so anonymous? I have a Reddit account that I’ve surely said things if someone was motivated they could make life hard for me - true things - bu…

It depends what your risk appetite is. I see it as layers.

So an organization with skill and motivation, like government agencies vs some specific person with a limited skillset and motivation Who are you trying to "hide" from?

Simply having a different username for each website helps with that. Personally for Facebook / Linkedin I never list my current employer. Enough of a layer to make it harder to track my employer for the casual lookup, but not impossible given enough time/money/competency.

I really like this graphic about what level of security you want vs who you are trying to protect from: https://anonymousplanet.org/media/image3.jpeg

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#98

Post by onion2k »

ta1234567890 wrote: post #43
InitialLastName wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

YC has a blacklist of people and companies. Not sure what will land you there, but I know they have it and use it.

If there's an actual blacklist where YC employees can just arbitrarily ban founders from working with certain companies that's quite surprising and maybe pretty bad for YC's reputation.

If you mean YC has a strong community of founders who share war stories of how people and companies were difficult to work with, and the other YC founders pay attention to those stories though, well, that's not a blacklist.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#99

Post by colechristensen »

nixpulvis wrote: post #47

Let's use Gender as a quick example, why not? A few years ago, I couldn't have said I thought about it at all. For better and for worse, it wasn't part of the discourse. Now, I'm not all that different, yet it comes up again and again. I'm often forced to choose a side, even when it's all hypotheticals and virtues. I feel forced because online media is permanent, each statement is my closing argument. When the litiga…

These people always existed, it is just an uncomfortable change. It used to be holier than thou people at church now it’s holier than thou suburban teenagers on social media. It’s uncomfortable because many people did and still do think these people are liberal and “on their side” and don’t get that this toxic human behavior has existed forever and goes between groups.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#100

Post by standardUser »

spectramax wrote: post #76
InitialLastName wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

This is a distraction and diversion from the original comment. Hollywood is not at the scale of the internet. Some privileged people got cancelled in Hollywood, who cares. When a hard working person gets cancelled by saying something stupid, the consequences are back breaking.

Forget Hollywood. Imagine trying to build the career of your choice as a black person, or a woman or an out gay person in that same era. Society was casually blacklisting the literal majority of Americans from most professional realms.
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