Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market • Hacker News Board

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#91

Post by sidlls » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:12 PM UTC

BrianOnHN wrote: post #21

cryptica wrote: post #5

Money printing and the Cantillion effects associated with it have created asymmetric playing fields which are fundamentally unfair. The injustice of modern markets can be explained with an analogy: Imagine that you don't have much money and you open a coffee shop; assume that it's your only stream of income... Now imagine that a few years later, a multi-millionaire opens up a coffee shop right next to yours as a pass…

Isn't this exactly how YC network effects work? Is that why the parent is downvoted?

It's how modern capitalism works, yes, and at least some of the downvotes are surely from freemarketeers who truly believe all the stuff described in the GP is just a perfectly fine, fair state of affairs.

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#92

Post by cudgy » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:14 PM UTC

throwaway9870 wrote: post #41

kemiller2002 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public service used to be thought of as a sacrifice for the good of all people. For many people it is. Teachers, social workers, public defenders, armed service people. All of these people make a pittance compared to what they could in the private sector. Saying a congressperson or a judge should be allowed to trade stocks simply because it affects their well being is an argument that appears rather frail. I would be…

> Teachers, social workers, public defenders, armed service people. I don't agree with that in all cases. I have a friend who is a teacher and admits teaching is a great job for him (2nd grade) and he doesn't know what he would do otherwise. Probably some type of physical work. He is a great guy, but just isn't that sharp. He is punctual and dependable, but not real good at thinking on his feet. He makes about $82k t…

“He is punctual and dependable, but not real good at thinking on his feet.”

Doesn’t this describe most people that do well in large organizations?

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#93

Post by FredPret » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:14 PM UTC

_wldu wrote: post #42

I've been down-voted for years for saying this, but I am right. The stock market is a scam. Just like casinos in Las Vegas. The house wins more often than we do. 'You need to diversify' simply means 'Give us more of your money'. Don't fall for it. It's just rich people and politicians taking money from less rich people. If you want to double your money, fold it over and put it in your pocket (and buy real things that…

Huge companies that pump out billions in profits and form the basis of modern life aren’t “real things”?!

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#94

Post by nova22033 » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:18 PM UTC

_wldu wrote: post #42

I've been down-voted for years for saying this, but I am right. The stock market is a scam. Just like casinos in Las Vegas. The house wins more often than we do. 'You need to diversify' simply means 'Give us more of your money'. Don't fall for it. It's just rich people and politicians taking money from less rich people. If you want to double your money, fold it over and put it in your pocket (and buy real things that…

'You need to diversify'

What? You can take a $100 investment and invest in a single stock or you could put $10 in a diversified portfolio....or put $100 in an index fund...

None of these options require investing more money..

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#95

Post by zz865 » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:21 PM UTC

kemiller2002 wrote: post #33

zz865 wrote: post #13

I understand that people shouldn't benefit from insider information for their personal trading - but there are rules around this. Blanket banning stock trading has a lot of downsides. Its an important part of everyone's financial wellbeing - esp if you are wealthy or powerful. I left my job in financial industry primarily because of this.

Public service used to be thought of as a sacrifice for the good of all people. For many people it is. Teachers, social workers, public defenders, armed service people. All of these people make a pittance compared to what they could in the private sector. Saying a congressperson or a judge should be allowed to trade stocks simply because it affects their well being is an argument that appears rather frail. I would be…

In America that is true which is one of the reasons US public service sucks. Places like France public servants are well paid, desirable and prestigious jobs.

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#96

Post by ItsMonkk » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:22 PM UTC

Spivak wrote: post #45

_wldu wrote: post #42

I've been down-voted for years for saying this, but I am right. The stock market is a scam. Just like casinos in Las Vegas. The house wins more often than we do. 'You need to diversify' simply means 'Give us more of your money'. Don't fall for it. It's just rich people and politicians taking money from less rich people. If you want to double your money, fold it over and put it in your pocket (and buy real things that…

How does this work with inflation? Like you have to put your money somewhere that’s appreciating at at least the rate of inflation or you’re losing money.

Everyone wants to only have as much money on hand as they need, and yet the money supply is at record numbers. Who is holding cash? How can there be 20T dollars depreciating every day?

The Fed with its policies that drop the Velocity of money naturally leads to asset price inflation. Even worse, as there are now more money being put into buybacks than there are into IPO's, the stock market is a deflationary asset class. Just because there is only a few places to risk your money and not devalue it, does not mean that those places aren't scams.

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#97

Post by amelius » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:25 PM UTC

_wldu wrote: post #42

I've been down-voted for years for saying this, but I am right. The stock market is a scam. Just like casinos in Las Vegas. The house wins more often than we do. 'You need to diversify' simply means 'Give us more of your money'. Don't fall for it. It's just rich people and politicians taking money from less rich people. If you want to double your money, fold it over and put it in your pocket (and buy real things that…

Of course it is a scam. Otherwise, why wouldn't we have government-run banks which invest our savings in the background for us?

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#98

Post by costcofries » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:26 PM UTC

cudgy wrote: post #82

SkipperCat wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not trying to be a hater, but if you follow most investing advice, you can do really well in the stock market. Don't try to pick stocks, just buy low load index funds (SPY, Russel2000) and hold onto them. Doing that, you can get above 6% yields over the course of a few decades. This has worked really well for so many people. Its boring, there's nothing sexy about it but you will retire with a decent chunk of cheddar.…

If everyone buys the same index funds, then all the money chases the same stocks within those index funds. The system feeds on itself resulting in overpricing of the index stocks which may not work out well during a sell-off. Index funds have risks too.

If more people invest in an asset, the price of the asset increases because its value also increases. This isn't overpricing, or the 'system' feeding itself, this is the value of assets increasing..

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#99

Post by rapsey » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:28 PM UTC

fennecfoxen wrote: post #90

rapsey wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How is it a scam? You buy stock. You own a share in a company, or in a company that owns more companies. Because the stock you buy may not have been actually bought by your broker. Which is the entire point of the GME saga which you completely misunderstand. A stock has no business being shorted over 100% in a market that is not a scam. Major firms can get away with crimes like naked shorting and no one can do anyth…

Meh. GME didn't stop trading because some fund had shorted the shares. They stopped trading because people couldn't be sure firms like Robin Hood would be good for the money. No one was prepared to go to bat and procure millions of dollars in meme-stocks for them, then be on the hook when those millions in dollars didn't show up. And everyone whined and whined and whined about "different rules for hedge funds!!!" Of…

> Meh. GME didn't stop trading because some fund had shorted the shares

The entire issue is a fund was allowed to short shares they did not have. An illegal act unless you are powerful enough. That is the origin and cause of the entire story.

No one disagrees that Robin Hood is garbage. But them being that is not the main issue at all.

RH having collateral is something entirely different from the shares you have suppose to have been owning being nothing but an IOU

Re: Redditors are right about the unfairness of the market

#100

Post by closeparen » Fri, Oct 01, 2021, 2:28 PM UTC

soco wrote: post #46

zz865 wrote: post #13

I understand that people shouldn't benefit from insider information for their personal trading - but there are rules around this. Blanket banning stock trading has a lot of downsides. Its an important part of everyone's financial wellbeing - esp if you are wealthy or powerful. I left my job in financial industry primarily because of this.

I can't see the downside in affecting the financial wellbeing of the wealthy and powerful.

Low-paying positions of power are a recipe for bribery.