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NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

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431–440 of 687 posts

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#431

There’s a lot of confusion here about why NFTs are valuable if the buyer doesn’t get to own the image copyright. This should not feel mysterious - NFTs are just like baseball cards. If you buy a Barry Bonds baseball card for $1,000, you don’t own the artistic rights to the image on the card. All you own is the card itself, which has negligible manufacturing cost. It would be trivial for any card company to produce a…

The difference between baseball cards and NFTs is that if I'm cold I can make a bonfire from baseball cards, whereas I certainly can't do the same with NFTs.

At this point, of you say crypto is involved with some new fad it's just a clear indicator that silicon snake oil is the real product.

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#432
post #429
post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you underestimate how important bragging rights are. That's the reason people purchase Rolex watches! And because you can't show off your Rolex watch in the online world, instead you'll use an NFT as a profil pic. I think it's hard for people that don't care about bragging rights / status symbols to understand NFTs. Conversely, I think that status symbols are a very important part of the lives of the people t…

I understand bragging rights, but it's pretty hard to brag with something noncorporeal. That profile pic? Anyone can use that, whether or not they own the NFT or not. Makes for some pretty poor bragging material if you ask me.

> That profile pic? Anyone can use that, whether or not they own the NFT or not.

Currently yes, but that's a fixable problem.

For instance Twitter could start preventing users from having profile pics that look similar to NFTs that were minted earlier.

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#433
post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NFTs are not like baseball cards. NFTs are a JSON string on a proprietary entity that point to the image of a baseball card. The image can be viewed by everyone. The bragging rights of owning a JSON string depend heavily on whether or not the proprietary entity will become the dominant player in the I own a JSON string -world. This also has zero to do with blockchains. The proprietary entity could've used any databas…

" The bragging rights of owning a JSON string depend heavily on whether or not the proprietary entity will become the dominant player in the I own a JSON string-world." -> as the parent post explains, this particular aspect is exactly like baseball cards; where technically anyone could print other Barry Bonds cards but your bragging rights of owning a rare baseball card depend heavily on whether or not the proprietar…

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Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#434
post #27

sorry to be pedantic, but it's literally not multi-level-marketing? Specifically, it's missing the multi-level part. Your upline isn't getting $$$ when you sell a NFT. I suppose you can make the argument that if you then take the money and buy more stuff, then your upline gets paid, but that describes most distributor arrangements. Come to think of it, there isn't really even an upline. It's just a network of artists…

When an NFT project proposes a value share and airdrops amongst token owners, and also has a royalty fee paid on every transfer [1], I think the “up line” and MLM aspect come more into play. There is value for you to inflate the price of the NFT as it benefits you and the other owners directly as sale prices get higher.

[1] https://support.opensea.io/hc/en-us/articles/1500009575482-H...

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People have been speculating on collectibles for thousands of years. Have they really? IMHO the whole concept of intentionally creating collectibles as a market started (and IMHO became possible) only after strict IP laws that could prevent anyone from making and distributing large quantities of items that should be rare by design. My favorite example is the fictional collectible card game Gwent in Witcher 3, where…

This is one of my main gripes with MtG. It just feel like a scam, a 90s loot boxes situation. I do not want to contribute to the business model, even if the product is solid. I will probably sell my collection and print some proxies.

MTG is kind the original lootbox, but I guess at least there is a reasonably good game behind it.

I dumped my MTG in the early 2000s, these days I'll only buy into a card game using the LCG/ECG model. It's not necessarily cheaper but it is less scummy.

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#436

All of this gushing hype for the future of artistry is transparently performative. Nobody in this tech cares about art or artists, any of the useful functions of NFTs have long been possible and many orders of magnitude less expensive using public key cryptography or digital signatures.

Eh I have spent ~100 on smaller stuff on hicetnunc. The majority has been on art made by people that I know, and I've really enjoyed the new artists that I've found. I'm uninterested in the NFTs with big price tags, and I'm uninterested in pieces that I don't subjectively enjoy the art of. I care, but I'm guessing you either didn't literally mean nobody cares, or you are going to brush off this counter example for wh…

I'm an amateur generative artist who just started minting on hic et nunc a month ago. I'm extremely sceptical and even disgusted by the big money NFTs, but minting and collecting on H=N has been a lot of fun, there is a very nice community as well.

Selling my art for ~real money for the first time has been such a motivating experience, even knowing that we are in a strong mania phase now. So I can say that I care too!

One thing to note is that hic et nunc is ran by one guy who doesn't really like to communicate and doesn't believe in paying for stuff like devops work, so I'm not sure if this will be the one site to survive on tezos. The community will eventually decide over time.

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#437

All of this gushing hype for the future of artistry is transparently performative. Nobody in this tech cares about art or artists, any of the useful functions of NFTs have long been possible and many orders of magnitude less expensive using public key cryptography or digital signatures.

Eh I have spent ~100 on smaller stuff on hicetnunc. The majority has been on art made by people that I know, and I've really enjoyed the new artists that I've found. I'm uninterested in the NFTs with big price tags, and I'm uninterested in pieces that I don't subjectively enjoy the art of. I care, but I'm guessing you either didn't literally mean nobody cares, or you are going to brush off this counter example for wh…

Interesting - what is it that makes you care? (Possibly related question: why didn't you just donate ~100 to the artists you found and enjoyed?)

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#438
post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An NFT is a virtual title of ownership on a blockchain, that's it. You don't own neither a string or an image or a JSON. https://eips.ethereum.org/EIPS/eip-721

It's actually simpler than that. It's just an entry in a database with your name attached to it. It's like an autograph. Why do database entries have value? Well, usually because there are processes attached to them. Often it is as simple as having a court enforce the process. I don't know why but the whole cryptocurrency space feels like a philosophical parody of the real world. Money without people. Contracts witho…

>I don't know why but the whole cryptocurrency space feels like a philosophical parody of the real world. Money without people. Contracts without enforcement. Ownership without property.

The common denominator between these being: process without purpose.

And this is why the parody works so well. The world is already like you describe, though it's hard to notice if you view it through the rose-tinted glasses that the ever-shrinking in-group is more than happy to sell to you for good "old" fiat money. (If 50 years ago is old.) Neoliberal "infinite growth" capitalism is already an inter-generational MLM, sanctioned by a global monopoly on violent enforcement. All power grows out of the barrel of a gun, and we have all become so delightfully non-violent... The logical conclusion: Oceania, Eurasia and Eastasia locked in perpetual war upon the background of a collapsed ecosystem?

Well, fuck that. Techno-capitalistic nation-states are an early-stage performance optimization. And since violent uprisings lead nowhere, we're doing the sane thing. We're refactoring 'em the fuck out of existence.

If "having a court enforce [a] process" is "simple", how come so many people already have "avoid courts", "distrust lawyers" as rules of thumb, and "don't side with authority" as a general life principle? For the marginalized majority, every state is a failed state, and every system is hostile and oppressive. The thing everyone's getting out of crypto is the same thing they've been getting out of all the other silly pyramid schemes, from Tupperware to contraband. Which is to say, the same things they've been aggressively denied by the state-sanctioned economic mainstream.

Hope. Opportunity. A voice.

A functioning parody of existing economical processes gives people the hope that there's a better economic system right around the corner. Maybe we just have to collectively sort of stumble into it.

Of course, it's only that simple if you have a simplified view of human creativity. But that's OK, too. Every invention that truly revolutionized our way of life was a somewhat accidental result of thousands upon thousands person-hours of organized research. And that's exactly what we're doing here - about as haphazardly as virtually any other kind of software development, but at the same time crowdfunded on a global scale.

Today, we're offering people the same sort of economic "junk food" that the current system has gotten them addicted to for the better part of the 20th century. Tomorrow, someone finally sneaks distributed consensus technology into the mainstream, and makes the world a little less corrupt.

It's beautiful.

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It apparently malfunctioned. He posted a video on Instagram of it a few days later of practice run that fully shredded it with a caption saying something like "worked in rehearsal"

It’s interesting how the malfunction itself created a very unique work of art depicting a moment suspended in time.

The work is actually back at auction now, with a significantly higher estimate than its original sale price.

https://www.sothebys.com/en/buy/auction/2021/contemporary-ar...

Re: NFT projects are just MLMs for tech elites

#440
post #340

There’s a lot of confusion here about why NFTs are valuable if the buyer doesn’t get to own the image copyright. This should not feel mysterious - NFTs are just like baseball cards. If you buy a Barry Bonds baseball card for $1,000, you don’t own the artistic rights to the image on the card. All you own is the card itself, which has negligible manufacturing cost. It would be trivial for any card company to produce a…

NFTs are not like baseball cards. NFTs are a JSON string on a proprietary entity that point to the image of a baseball card. The image can be viewed by everyone. The bragging rights of owning a JSON string depend heavily on whether or not the proprietary entity will become the dominant player in the I own a JSON string -world. This also has zero to do with blockchains. The proprietary entity could've used any databas…

Can you give an example of the proprietary entity you're referring to? I was curious so I took a short course that covered minting NFTs with Solidity, and the way it seemed to work is that the JSON strings (which contain the base64 encoded image) are stored (as an ERC-721 token) on the Ethereum blockchain. Eg. you can see a random such token here: https://rinkeby.etherscan.io/token/0x6b96751051cd25c29cdcea7...

The only proprietary entity involved in that process seems to be Alchemy. My understanding of them is a bit vague but they seem to just help with making miners aware of the new contract and getting it distributed. But that's just the contract, once it's deployed it's nothing to do with them and the NFTs AFAIK don't pass through them at all.

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