YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content • Hacker News Board

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#551

Post by mountainriver » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:13 PM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #450

mariodiana wrote: post #65

I think we have to ask if this won't have a chilling effect on open discussion by moderate voices. I'm subscribed to the channel of an M.D. on YouTube who discusses COVID-19, vaccines, etc. He is very careful to (repeatedly) point out that he is vaccinated, he has personally vaccinated hundreds of patients, he encourages everyone to speak to their doctor and follow their recommendations, believing that the vaccine is…

I was banned from a Reddit sub for saying that a previous Covid infection probably infers some immunity. This was around 8 months ago. Now EU vaccine passports accept a recovery from infection as being sufficient proof of immunity. On top of that now it's coming out that the Canadian military/government (and likely others) was intentionally deploying propaganda to make the populace more compliant. This is why moderat…

Reddit has a way of drowning out moderate voices which is why I no longer use it

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#552

Post by uhtred » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #65

I think we have to ask if this won't have a chilling effect on open discussion by moderate voices. I'm subscribed to the channel of an M.D. on YouTube who discusses COVID-19, vaccines, etc. He is very careful to (repeatedly) point out that he is vaccinated, he has personally vaccinated hundreds of patients, he encourages everyone to speak to their doctor and follow their recommendations, believing that the vaccine is…

youtube is a private company, they can ban you for whatever reason they want, presumably. Youtube, google, facebook, they aren't public services.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#553

Post by lijogdfljk » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:14 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #65

I think we have to ask if this won't have a chilling effect on open discussion by moderate voices. I'm subscribed to the channel of an M.D. on YouTube who discusses COVID-19, vaccines, etc. He is very careful to (repeatedly) point out that he is vaccinated, he has personally vaccinated hundreds of patients, he encourages everyone to speak to their doctor and follow their recommendations, believing that the vaccine is…

Frankly, i applaud this censorship. Granted i'm super left/liberal/pro-vax/etc so i'm _definitely_ not in the camp of anti-vaxxers, however we have for years put all our faith and trust in corporations.

Now private entities aren't aligning with a lot of people and they're shocked that corporations aren't the free speech utopia that they once thought. It frustrates me that many of these people didn't care when it was others that were oppressed, but i digress.

Regardless, this sort of mostly harmless but highly sensationalized censorship is very good for our freedoms in my mind because it forces us to decentralize. We've become far too centralized and complacent in unwarranted corporate faith. This is to be expected, and people should have been prepared.

Let Youtube/etc censor all it wants. We need better than Youtube. Wake people up to that. My 2c.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#554

Post by StatsAreFun » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:16 PM UTC

landryraccoon wrote: post #447

Here's a thought experiment. Suppose we were at war with a hostile adversary, and that adversary had killed over 700,000 people already, and thousands more each day. I can scarcely believe that any reasonable person would argue that blocking propaganda or misinformation that harms the war effort would be an egregious imposition on free speech. Once the imminent threat is over, those efforts can and should stop, but n…

That's a good point about the extraordinary measures taken. Accordingly, since the number of deaths from the top three causes of U.S. deaths in 2019 were heart disease (659,041), cancer (599,601) and accidents (173,040), we should boycott all propaganda or misinformation around how being overweight is healthy, immediately close all fast food establishments, provide free fruits & vegetables for all Americans, close all beaches to prevent anyone from getting too much sun, immediately ban all products containing cancer causing agents of any kind, mandate all cars & trucks contain ignition lockouts that would prevent the vehicles from starting if seat belts were not worn properly, immediately ban all motorcycles, immediately ban all swimming pools or mandate all Americans wear flotation devices or risk fines & imprisonment, immediately ban all guns & knives regardless of their intended purpose, immediately ban all contact sports and other sports that are considered "extreme" or high-risk, and ban all ladders & stools. If we can reduce or eliminate outright the 1,431,682 people killed from these causes, regardless of the impact on the economy or personal liberty, it would be worth it. Those people are also dead and definitely not coming back. We owe it to their families and communities to do everything we can to prevent further deaths from these causes as well.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#555

Post by baron_harkonnen » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:16 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #65

I think we have to ask if this won't have a chilling effect on open discussion by moderate voices. I'm subscribed to the channel of an M.D. on YouTube who discusses COVID-19, vaccines, etc. He is very careful to (repeatedly) point out that he is vaccinated, he has personally vaccinated hundreds of patients, he encourages everyone to speak to their doctor and follow their recommendations, believing that the vaccine is…

> It's not the wackos we should be worrying about.

It's really amazing to me how easily the "left" was able to be tricked in the same death of critical thinking as the "right".

The "stick to the libs!" angle is far more responsible for the rise in support of Trump leading up to the election. People on the "right" were manipulated for decades into reducing their political beliefs to defending themselves from a fictitious adversary (this is why I put quotes around these terms). If you listen to any radical Trump supporter you'll quickly see that a large part of their logic is based on a deeply held belief that roughly half the country is mind washed, irrational liberals that seek to destroy their way of life.

This rewriting of people skeptical of the vaccines as "wackos" serves the same purpose for the "left" and mainstream progressives have gobbled it up without hesitation. They now see roughly half the country as a bunch mind washed, irrational "wackos" that are a threat to the foundations of our society.

Both the "left" and "right" (terms which honestly don't make any political sense any more, evidence by exactly this irrational support for corporate suppression of voices on the "left" and it's dissent on the "right") are currently structured so that any real, meaningful political discourse about the future of the country is dissolved into two insane groups of people throwing rocks at each other.

If you find yourself defined by either of these major narratives, then you are being played.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#556

Post by iotku » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:16 PM UTC

landryraccoon wrote: post #447

Here's a thought experiment. Suppose we were at war with a hostile adversary, and that adversary had killed over 700,000 people already, and thousands more each day. I can scarcely believe that any reasonable person would argue that blocking propaganda or misinformation that harms the war effort would be an egregious imposition on free speech. Once the imminent threat is over, those efforts can and should stop, but n…

>Once the imminent threat is over, those efforts can and should stop, but not while the destruction is immediate.

The destruction is always immediate, there's always risks, and there's always going to be another possible (virus|war|dangerous criminal|wrong-thinker|...) in the future.

The only time I have any (although low) expectation of a policy ending is when I'm given a definite end date with a binding promise that it won't be extended.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#557

Post by sokoloff » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:16 PM UTC

CodeMage wrote: post #433

mariodiana wrote: post #65

I think we have to ask if this won't have a chilling effect on open discussion by moderate voices. I'm subscribed to the channel of an M.D. on YouTube who discusses COVID-19, vaccines, etc. He is very careful to (repeatedly) point out that he is vaccinated, he has personally vaccinated hundreds of patients, he encourages everyone to speak to their doctor and follow their recommendations, believing that the vaccine is…

> Months ago he was insisting that the people who had contracted COVID-19 and who had antibodies in their system may not need the vaccine. Now, we have a number of studies coming out to support that. But months ago that was "anti-vax" (employing the slanderous use of the term). If you're claiming something that hasn't been demonstrated through peer-reviewed scientific research, then you're offering your opinion. If y…

There wasn’t scientific consensus that recovery from COVID did not leave antibodies in your system so as to make vaccine unnecessary. It was undecided.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#558

Post by trentnix » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:17 PM UTC

YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

Which will, of course, galvanize those who are skeptical of the vaccine and the intentions of our bureaucratic overlords. And because that's so obvious, it makes the conspiracy-theorist squirrel part of my brain wonder if that's the point.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#559

Post by squeaky-clean » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:18 PM UTC

afarrell wrote: post #83

If I recall correctly, the internet was born from a DARPA project to enable resilient communications that would ensure a nuclear missile launch order would always get through. If so, then it is indeed contrary to the spirit of the internet to block messages on the basis that they guide people to actions which cause harm to existing structures. The internet interprets censorship as damage and routes around it. My ques…

People can still post anti-vax things on the internet if they want. Youtube is not the internet.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#560

Post by d0gsg0w00f » Wed, Sep 29, 2021, 5:18 PM UTC

MrRadar wrote: post #306

crocodiletears wrote: post #238

At this point I'm not hesitant about the vaccine, but getting it would only validate the heavy-handed approach we're seeing wrt censorship.

So you understand and acknowledge that this vaccine can literally save your life, and you accept all the science that shows that it is safe and effective, but you refuse to get it because some people are being forbidden (by a privately-owned platform, only on that platform) to spread lies about how it's not safe or effective? That's a very strange position to take, to put your own life in literal mortal danger becaus…

I'm a breakthrough case. Nobody in the testing office asked me if I was vaccinated. The breakthrough wasn't tracked in any system to my knowledge. How many more of me are out there? I only know anecdotally that at least 10 people 1 or 2 degrees of separation from myself are also breakthrough cases. I'm sure I was very contagious during this time but as soon as I tested positive I quarantined. I personally don't trust that these statistics are being tracked properly.

My point is that although I'm glad I got vaccinated, vaccination is not the panacea the media makes ot out to be.