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Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

wsj.com

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Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#151

Post by user-the-name »

hungryforcodes wrote: post #150
user-the-name wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why, exactly, did they try to make it impossible for themselves to do this, if that is something they actually want to do?

It's not impossible. They do this all the time for law enforcement. Did even read the links?

I read the article, which said Apple wanted to make this impossible for themselves, but then police complained so they didn't.

If they wanted to do it in the first place, why did they go to the effort of trying to make it impossible and had to be stopped by police?

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#152

Post by hungryforcodes »

user-the-name wrote: post #151
hungryforcodes wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not impossible. They do this all the time for law enforcement. Did even read the links?

I read the article, which said Apple wanted to make this impossible for themselves, but then police complained so they didn't. If they wanted to do it in the first place, why did they go to the effort of trying to make it impossible and had to be stopped by police?

I'm assuming the FBI and various other law enforcement agencies would have kept pushing for access anyways, most likely by escalating to legal or legislative means ("let's ban encryption" type thing).

Despite what one may think of the police, they do have a legal basis for attempting to collect possible evidence in the natural course of their duties when equipped with an appropriate warrant. In such cases Apple might have been exposed to any number of different legal problems, including obstruction of justice accusations.

So it was probably just easier for Apple to comply. But who knows what the thinking was.

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#154

Post by ashtonkem »

sangnoir wrote: post #146
ashtonkem wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why all the afib data from watchOS got leaked to increase insurance costs, right? Right? Sometimes the sky does not actually fall.

Less than 24 hours ago, the top story on HN was a tranche of iOS 0-days released by a whitehat who got frustrated by Apple's mismanagement of its bug bounty program. So it's open season on that afib data right now...

It does not follow that 0 days mean every piece of information in apple’s control will be stolen. Historically apple 0 days have been used to target high level targets, usually journalists, and not appropriate (or usable) for removing all data from all iPhones.

Something Apple should fix, sure. But not something that I’m going to delete all my Apple Health data for.

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#155

Post by [deleted] »

ArchStanton wrote: post #54

I can imagine the advertising value of watching for depression and cognitive decline. In the latter case, you could probably sell a dozen extended warranties for the same item. EZ prediction of the day. Combine depression, cognitive decline, anger, etc. values against a database of gun owners (picked up through registration, social media posts, ATF background checks, etc.). Send police to house when some crossover po…

[deleted]

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#156

Post by ashtonkem »

concinds wrote: post #86

A little dismayed that the sci-fi "tech futurism" attitude of previous decades is now a beaten, lifeless corpse. Opt-in health features that give you more control over your health? World-ending! But 20 years ago, we were imagining a little wristband-type machine that would be able to non-invasively and routinely analyse blood samples, detecting cancer a decade early, increasing human lifespans, etc. This pattern is a…

> People today may be deciding to drop all smartphones, avoid modern TVs, avoid modern computers and stick to a 2008 barebones ThinkPad, give up music streaming services and run their own email

Far more people talk about such things than actually do it. It’s the technological equivalent of “I’m moving to Canada”.

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#157

Post by ashtonkem »

sneak wrote: post #133
ArchStanton wrote: post #54

I can imagine the advertising value of watching for depression and cognitive decline. In the latter case, you could probably sell a dozen extended warranties for the same item. EZ prediction of the day. Combine depression, cognitive decline, anger, etc. values against a database of gun owners (picked up through registration, social media posts, ATF background checks, etc.). Send police to house when some crossover po…

This is precisely why there isn't a central database of gun owners in the USA. Some states have even banned the keeping of identifying data in purchase records at the individual stores, too.

Never mind all the states that allow private transfer without a FFL.

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#158

Post by amelius »

AnonC wrote: post #131
amelius wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem here is the tight integration by Apple: the app and the networking services are implemented by the same company. I'd be ok with an app by a third party which does not automatically gets network access on my phone explicitly or implicitly, so I know my data doesn't leave my phone.

Your wish wouldn’t work on iOS. Apple hasn’t so far focused on adding Internet access permission. Every app on the device gets access to the network by default. There is no way to stop one app from accessing the Internet while allowing others.

Sorry to use the phrase but this sucks. I feel like companies are too much focused on pushing shiny stuff while forgetting about basic security features.

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#159

Post by user-the-name »

hungryforcodes wrote: post #152
user-the-name wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the article, which said Apple wanted to make this impossible for themselves, but then police complained so they didn't. If they wanted to do it in the first place, why did they go to the effort of trying to make it impossible and had to be stopped by police?

I'm assuming the FBI and various other law enforcement agencies would have kept pushing for access anyways, most likely by escalating to legal or legislative means ("let's ban encryption" type thing). Despite what one may think of the police, they do have a legal basis for attempting to collect possible evidence in the natural course of their duties when equipped with an appropriate warrant. In such cases Apple might…

No, I am asking you why you keep claiming again and again that Apple wants this data. You have this clear evidence that they tried to make it harder to for themselves to get this data.

Why would they do that, if they want the data? Are they just complete morons?

Re: Apple is working on iPhone features to help detect depression, cognitive decline

#160

Post by hungryforcodes »

user-the-name wrote: post #159
hungryforcodes wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm assuming the FBI and various other law enforcement agencies would have kept pushing for access anyways, most likely by escalating to legal or legislative means ("let's ban encryption" type thing). Despite what one may think of the police, they do have a legal basis for attempting to collect possible evidence in the natural course of their duties when equipped with an appropriate warrant. In such cases Apple might…

No, I am asking you why you keep claiming again and again that Apple wants this data. You have this clear evidence that they tried to make it harder to for themselves to get this data. Why would they do that, if they want the data? Are they just complete morons?

We started with this statement though:

"Apple health data stored on iCloud is encrypted so that Apple can not access it."

Whatever anyone is saying, they CAN access it if they want, and do so for law enforcement as needed.

From what I understand you are the one that seems to believe that Apple has tried to make it hard for themselves. I've been saying all along it's trivial for them to unlock iCloud data. As to why I say that -- the recent CSAM thing made me realize that I don't trust them. It's a personal thing.

Nor do I really care. I don't use Apple anymore, and I sleep better at night.

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