Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#121

Post by selimthegrim » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:34 PM UTC

concordDance wrote: post #29

prvc wrote: post #4

>A growing pile of video-game histories [...] suggest that the medium has always had collective effort at its heart, from its academic beginnings to its ascent into everyday life. In Meier’s memoir, we discover that he was a good game-maker when he fought this essential fact, but that he became great when he learned to embrace it. >The strength of the modding community is, instead, the very reason the series survived…

I don't think I'd agree, the best games in terms of concept and fun (as opposed to polish like Witcher 3) are those with essentially one or two people making the fundamental game. Things like Slay the Spire, factorio and Rimworld had 1 or 2 people making the game what it is, with some later folk adding some polish.

For a second I thought you literally meant Polish

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#122

Post by NittLion78 » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:35 PM UTC

hyperman1 wrote: post #32

Deestan wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Doom/Quake Doom was a tense collaboration between Carmack and Romero. Carmack was geniusing out the engine, while Romero was pulling hard on the game atmosphere, music, level design and details like the timer that spawned Doom's speedrunning culture. Quake , which was Romero-less, was a technical masterpiece, but not a very memorable game. There was the brown level, the other brown level, and the brown level again…

The artist of doom is a forgotten hero apart from Romero/Carmack. He had a background with nasty medical images, so the hellish deformed people were a good fit. Without it's art, doom would be a very different game.

That's Adrian Carmack (no relation to John). He made most of the characters you see in the game out of clay before they were pixelated.

Can't recommend Masters of Doom enough, the book that talks about the history of id Software. That all these guys came together in the same place is a miracle in itself.

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#123

Post by tannhauser23 » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:35 PM UTC

prvc wrote: post #4

>A growing pile of video-game histories [...] suggest that the medium has always had collective effort at its heart, from its academic beginnings to its ascent into everyday life. In Meier’s memoir, we discover that he was a good game-maker when he fought this essential fact, but that he became great when he learned to embrace it. >The strength of the modding community is, instead, the very reason the series survived…

Shout-out to Brian Reynolds, who was the lead designer on both Civ 2 and Alpha Centauri!

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#124

Post by thedogeye » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

rkagerer wrote: post #74

Absolutely loved this series, but never acclimated to the 3D maps they switched to after Civ 3. You couldn't see as much of the world at once, and units and terrain became more difficult to discern. I wound up playing in the strategic overlay, with mods that relieved some of the claustrophobia, but it never felt as slick as the earlier 2D / isomorphic view. Other classic strategy games from that era followed the tren…

in Civ 6 you can toggle back to the 2D graphics really easily, i sometimes play that way bc its easier to see the resource squares.

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#125

Post by selimthegrim » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

vanderZwan wrote: post #46

prvc wrote: post #4

>A growing pile of video-game histories [...] suggest that the medium has always had collective effort at its heart, from its academic beginnings to its ascent into everyday life. In Meier’s memoir, we discover that he was a good game-maker when he fought this essential fact, but that he became great when he learned to embrace it. >The strength of the modding community is, instead, the very reason the series survived…

I think it matters whether or not you look at games that are a single "work" or games that are part of a series. For example, I think Lukas Pope is a good modern example of single author creating really unique and novel games. Civ 2 and Alpha Centauri on the other hand are more like good examples of fresh ideas being injected into a series under new leadership.

It’s debatable whether Obra Dinn is a video novel instead, although you can argue it predicted the recent Columbo revival

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#126

Post by selimthegrim » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:37 PM UTC

NittLion78 wrote: post #122

hyperman1 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The artist of doom is a forgotten hero apart from Romero/Carmack. He had a background with nasty medical images, so the hellish deformed people were a good fit. Without it's art, doom would be a very different game.

That's Adrian Carmack (no relation to John). He made most of the characters you see in the game out of clay before they were pixelated. Can't recommend Masters of Doom enough, the book that talks about the history of id Software. That all these guys came together in the same place is a miracle in itself.

And in Shreveport, nonetheless. Go look at that building on Google Street View sometimes.

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#127

Post by rubslopes » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:41 PM UTC

rkagerer wrote: post #74

Absolutely loved this series, but never acclimated to the 3D maps they switched to after Civ 3. You couldn't see as much of the world at once, and units and terrain became more difficult to discern. I wound up playing in the strategic overlay, with mods that relieved some of the claustrophobia, but it never felt as slick as the earlier 2D / isomorphic view. Other classic strategy games from that era followed the tren…

If you have an Android phone, try the great UnCiv game.

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#128

Post by mdp2021 » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:41 PM UTC

UncleMeat wrote: post #87

knighthack wrote: post #78

Why does the author keep referring to the player as 'her'? This neither seems in line with the traditional use of 'he/him' in English texts, or even the neutrality of 'he/him and or she/her'. It reads more like a stunted attempt to virtue signal. I'm quite confident that Civilization games skew to male players, rather than female. What a great way to alienate readers. More so when gender was not a central feature of…

Referring to abstract actors as "she" and "her" only alienates a very specific kind of reader. Consciously using female pronouns in these contexts is a very small way of pushing against the norm of everything being male, which is commendable. You'll see it more and more in CS papers nowadays. I cannot possibly imagine being upset by this.

> pushing against the norm of everything being male

The perception some have is instead that of inserting gender where it was irrelevant. (Those "some" do not associate 'he' and masculine, probably also for cultural reasons as expressed nearby.)

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#129

Post by joejohns » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:43 PM UTC

rkagerer wrote: post #74

Absolutely loved this series, but never acclimated to the 3D maps they switched to after Civ 3. You couldn't see as much of the world at once, and units and terrain became more difficult to discern. I wound up playing in the strategic overlay, with mods that relieved some of the claustrophobia, but it never felt as slick as the earlier 2D / isomorphic view. Other classic strategy games from that era followed the tren…

If you're going to try 3D maps, Humankind is the way to go. It feels like a Civ sequel but with a twist.

Re: Sid Meier and the meaning of ‘Civilization’

#130

Post by samsolomon » Thu, Sep 23, 2021, 4:47 PM UTC

kryptiskt wrote: post #65

prvc wrote: post #4

>A growing pile of video-game histories [...] suggest that the medium has always had collective effort at its heart, from its academic beginnings to its ascent into everyday life. In Meier’s memoir, we discover that he was a good game-maker when he fought this essential fact, but that he became great when he learned to embrace it. >The strength of the modding community is, instead, the very reason the series survived…

I love Civilization, but I think the most singular thing Sid Meier ever did was Pirates. It's weird that there are so few attempts to modernize/rip-off that concept out there.

Pirates! and Railroads! were both loads of fun.

Railway Empire has a lot of the same mechanics as Railroads! but with much better graphics a little added complexity. I don't that many video games these days, but Railway Empire is one I find myself going back to play again and again.

Would be nice to see someone do the same for Pirates!