To deploy an NFT contract^*
Which is a pretty minimal contract, a few hundred LOC
It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
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Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#62I wrote that smart contract as concept art! ( https://cryptologie.net/article/542/project-memento-an-nft-a... ). Nice to see this on the front page :) A few years ago, deploying a smart contract only cost a few dollars. It raised questions like “wouldn’t anyone then spam the blockchain and increase its size in non-scalable way?” I guess pricing “solved” that issue. We considered Avalanche as an alternative, as it sup…
Like a million-dollars pixel but with letters. https://project-memento.com
That was the inspiration!
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's because they are not contracts per se, smart or otherwise. They are autonomous agents that act as your counterparty.
Wow, that sounds fancy and sounds almost like an AI counterparty when you put it that way. Did you mean counterparty (the other person in the transaction) or trusted third party (the third leg of most transactions, like lawyers who negotiate then witness a deal). My understanding was smart contracts attempt to replace the trusted third party with a trusted system. But are they autonomous and do they really have any a…
I meant as the other "person" in the transaction. I believe Japanese regulators adopted the term "person-to-machine" or "machine-to-machine" transactions in order to describe "smart contracts", as they are not contracts in the legal sense.
The reason I called them "autonomous agents" because they don't really fulfill any part of a standard contract. No choice of jurisdiction, no severability clause etc. More of a judge&jury&executioner all in one.
They are rather rigid and somewhat limited today, but I'd guess they are autonomous in the sense you can make them nearly unalterable once deployed. I suppose wih time we will be interacting with AI-agents at some point, there are some rather wild projects trying to do just that.
It may not strike you as particularly useful, but some decentralized exchanges (uniswap, dydx) that now clear more trading volume than Coinbase, a 100 billion dollar company. This has to mean something.
I have no idea if they could ever supercede legal contracts. Maybe in a 100 years.
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#64That's cute. Now if you want to add a few modules like KYC, make it upgradeable (need to deploy a proxy and a proxy admin) and gasless (deployment through a forwarder) and you'll be around ~3000$. I mention those modules as those are the ones needed to provide the same services as a notary. This raise the issue that ETH is starting to no longer be competitive with the establishment. It's a bit aggravating as for many…
is there a standard eth cookbook that you are referencing? proxy and proxy admins, gasless forwarders? is there a standard body of knowledge compiled somewhere abuot this?
Gasless is made possible by meta transactions, a proposal from last year:
https://eips.ethereum.org/EIPS/eip-2771
For which Openzepplin proposes documentation and an implementation https://docs.openzeppelin.com/contracts/4.x/api/metatx https://github.com/OpenZeppelin/openzeppelin-contracts/tree/...
Proxied versions of standard contracts are also proposed by Openzeppelin: https://docs.openzeppelin.com/upgrades-plugins/1.x/writing-u... https://github.com/OpenZeppelin/openzeppelin-contracts-upgra...
For KYC you'll need to implement your own ERC20 compatible token with some checks in the transfer functions. The CMTA is the Swiss contract reference and proposes one: https://github.com/CMTA/CMTA20
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#65This is why Cardano[1] might be interesting with their Plutus [2] and Marlowe[3] languages. [1] https://cardano.org/ [2] https://github.com/input-output-hk/plutus [3] https://alpha.marlowe.iohkdev.io/
Why is this comment so heavily down-voted? The parent provides an alternative blockchain, that has been really well engineered by a world class team of developers. Is decentralized, has the ability to write smart contracts, has already implemented some of the features eth 2.0 is promising, currently sitting 3rd place in terms of market-cap right behind Ethereum (which we are talking about here). Some of you people wh…
Because it's like saying 'I'm having problems with windows, how do I fix it' and someone coming along and saying 'use linux'. I don't find it that helpful.
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is just one of many VC backed coins trying to be the next Ethereum. These VC coins don't enable mining so there's no dilution on the initial holders. Saving the environment is just a nice alibi to lock in the cap table. There's also no disclosure on what price did the initial round happen at. 40 cents/80 cents /1$? If you buy Gold/Copper you have a fair idea on what the mining cost is for the industry. These are…
And Ethereum didn't have a presale of 70%+ of the supply? That somehow didn't lock-in the captable? ETH foundation (which is completely non-transparent btw) doesn't control the trademark and employs go-eth team? I guess 30% for miners is a nice alibi.
You have incremental supply on ETH available to those who deploy mining assets. This broadens ownership through dilution.
Solana has had multiple funding rounds and not just one. They can continue to have as many funding rounds as they like.
There will be never be dilution of Solana holders to allow for decentralisation. To earn coins through staking you need to be a preexisting holder.
Running a node doesn't make economic sense and there are plenty of validators which don't charge a commission for delegation. You have no variable costs as an entrenched holder who can just stake coins for more coins till eternity.
All future supply on Solana will only take place through staking unless the backers think otherwise. https://etherscan.io/chart/ethersupplygrowth
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#67Earlier quoted context omitted.
I can hack into those providers as well, right? My worry was that the chain of trust is broken by definition - as soon as you store things outside the chain. I really don't understand why one would dilute the value proposition of the blockchain like that. If I have a Ferrari I shouldn't put monster truck wheels on it only because it can't drive over speed bumps - it kills the "ferrari-ness".
> My worry was that the chain of trust is broken by definition As I understand it, the idea is you put the data itself off chain but keep hashes on chain. Anyone who downloads the data can verify it by checking that the hash matches what is stored on chain.
Uh, no, you store nothing of sorts. Which is the problem. According to ERC-721 (NFT standard) you store exactly three things: the name, a cute pic and the URI to its definition file somewhere else (not even that definition has a hash, not that it would help anything).
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#68Does anyone know any examples of useful smart contracts on Ethereum? Most of what I hear on the news in either NFTs or toy problems like lotteries.
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#69I wonder what the cost of deploying the same NFT contracts on L2s would be?
On a real L2 (so no sidechains like Polygon, Avax) probably around 30$ to 50$. It should go down when they unthrottle transactions.
Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
But storing things off-chain kinda kills the entire concept, doesn't it? If I hack into DigitalOcean I can mess everybody's NFTs by tampering with one database.
> But storing things off-chain kinda kills the entire concept, doesn't it? If I hack into DigitalOcean I can mess everybody's NFTs by tampering with one database. It's not about storing off-chain, you compute off-chain and post to the network a cryptographic proof of the computation. Rollups provide something akin to lossless compression proofs of computation. You execute the computation off-chain with high throughpu…
NFT definition is stored off-chain. Which means the security you defined on the chain protects only the URI to a random file or some database - which can be modified any time DigitalOcean or the hacker decides to modify. So you're right, we can create quickly and safely keys to the metal front door, while the back door is propped with a stick.