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Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

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Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#71

Post by cyanydeez »

grishka wrote: post #41
TheAdamist wrote: post #28

...and if the final appeal goes against apple it will coincidentally be blacklisted for an entirely unrelated and new reason shortly thereafter.

Not if a court decision or a new law forces Apple to finally allow sideloading apps on iOS.

pretty sure the orznge menace lit the torch of litigate it to outrun it. only laws gonna come down reauire a bipartisan congress and that is easily staved off with enough lobbiests.

having a split congress means you only need a couple of senstors in pocket.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#72

Post by matt_heimer »

max1cc wrote: post #68
matt_heimer wrote: post #59

Anyone know where Apple stated they'd "welcome Epic’s return to the App Store if they agree to play by the same rules as everyone else" as Tim states? I see where Apple said everybody should play by the same rules but given that Epic not only violated the policy (which has now been changed) but also purposely cheated on the review process it seems justified that they are still banned.

The only place I can find the quote is in an article from The Verge from a couple of weeks ago: https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/10/22667069/fortnite-ios-ret...

Thanks, that article links to an earlier one https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/10/22666146/apple-epic-korea... which says:

Apple, however, maintains it’s under no obligation to let Epic in the App Store at all. “As we’ve said all along, we would welcome Epic’s return to the App Store if they agree to play by the same rules as everyone else,” an Apple spokesperson says in a statement to The Verge. “Epic has admitted to breach of contract and as of now, there’s no legitimate basis for the reinstatement of their developer account.”

So it sounds like it was in a statement to The Verge that was split into parts for the article and Tim is cherry picking the part that suits Epic. Seems impossible for Epic to play by the same rules as everyone else and be allowed back in since they broke more rules than the one that has now been changed. They really should have tried a legal approach first before sneaking their app store in.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#73

Post by matt_heimer »

TheAdamist wrote: post #28

...and if the final appeal goes against apple it will coincidentally be blacklisted for an entirely unrelated and new reason shortly thereafter.

They violated the feature flag part of the guidelines, does Apple really need another reason? https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/72176

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#74

Post by pankajdoharey »

TheAdamist wrote: post #28

...and if the final appeal goes against apple it will coincidentally be blacklisted for an entirely unrelated and new reason shortly thereafter.

Apple is not a democracy nor is Epic, the one with most raw power generally wins in such scenario.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#75

Post by xg15 »

pankajdoharey wrote: post #74
TheAdamist wrote: post #28

...and if the final appeal goes against apple it will coincidentally be blacklisted for an entirely unrelated and new reason shortly thereafter.

Apple is not a democracy nor is Epic, the one with most raw power generally wins in such scenario.

Sounds great for users...

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#76

Post by 1_player »

Factorium wrote: post #58
literallyaduck wrote: post #49

Epic, Steam, and Framework should team up to build a user centric phone which runs Arch not Android and runs all their games.

Valve are definitely not user-centred. They are profit centred. Valve provide no subsidised hardware (PC gamers still need to supply their own), and charge indie developers 30% commissions, a regressive 'tax' compared to the 20% they charge AAA. Per-employee, Valve is the most profitable company in America, and Gabe Newell the 97th richest American. They got there with forced exclusives (Half Life 2 could only be act…

Of course Valve is not a charity, but of all companies in their space or close to them, they are miles ahead than any competition because users like using their product. Simple as that.

Everybody prefers Steam to EGS not _only_ because they're stuck there, but because it's genuinely a better product. It's golden handcuffs, but a fantastic product nonetheless.

In my opinion Valve has found the perfect balance between making gamers, a notoriously difficult category of people hard to please, happy and making serious money. Laughing all the way to the bank while single-handedly improving the status of Linux gaming and desktop in general. I'm more than OK with that.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#77

Post by mlyle »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #61
mrtksn wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it’s an abuse, it’s simply a business. Apple holds the minority share of smartphones WW. It’s perfectly possible not to do work on their platform if the terms are not good. I’m annoyed when they sherlock someone but not when they stick to the agreement they made with the developers.

In the vast majority of markets where having apps is simply secondary to the core business, it's rather impossible to succeed without both an android and an apple app. In the US its practically 50/50, and being forced to write off 50% of the US, who have no other way to install your app, is ridiculous. And a 30% cut is absolutely massive, for comparison, Walmarts profit margin in 2020 was 3%. That it has been allowed…

> And a 30% cut is absolutely massive, for comparison, Walmarts profit margin in 2020 was 3%.

Note that comparing markup to profit margin is apples and oranges. Comparing to a particularly low-margin provider is perhaps misleading, too.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#78

Post by pankajdoharey »

xg15 wrote: post #75
pankajdoharey wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is not a democracy nor is Epic, the one with most raw power generally wins in such scenario.

Sounds great for users...

Well stones do get ground up between milling stones.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#79

Post by spywaregorilla »

mrtksn wrote: post #63
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the vast majority of markets where having apps is simply secondary to the core business, it's rather impossible to succeed without both an android and an apple app. In the US its practically 50/50, and being forced to write off 50% of the US, who have no other way to install your app, is ridiculous. And a 30% cut is absolutely massive, for comparison, Walmarts profit margin in 2020 was 3%. That it has been allowed…

I agree that a regulation is needed for certain things. What I don’t agree is Epic bullying it’s way because that (assumed) they can. BTW the %30 is fine considering the service they give. They handle the international trade part of the business, which is vastly different from what Walmart does. If you were to sell directly to customers, you would have to incorporate in each and every country there is(because you nee…

A kid could do all of that on epic's store for 12% instead of apple's 30% if apple wasn't allowed to force it to be the only option.

A free market would figure out what the real fair percentage really is.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#80

Post by ece »

OldHand2018 wrote: post #52
emsy wrote: post #50

No Apple is definitely not abusing their market position by controlling (and taxing) the access to millions of customers.

That's exactly what the judge said.

Exactly why there should be regulation like OAMA, EU DMA, etc..
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